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  #11  
Old 03-13-2008, 12:19 AM
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Mscotrid Mscotrid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Ranger View Post
I base all my product comparisons @ 1lb of N per M rate. Using more gas carrying the extra 200lbs of product never crossed my mind, but over a years time it might be a lot more gas consumed. Great point. You would also be amazed how many LCO's buy on bag price and not on coverage. There are quite a few that don't know how to figure the number of lbs of NPK in the bag.

I agree with that statement 100%...maybe with a tight upcoming year some of those might be weeded out (no pun intended) and I can bill more for my service.
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  #12  
Old 03-13-2008, 12:31 AM
golfguy golfguy is offline
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I whole heartedly agree with grassmechanic. To base price solely on N is not really a true picture. To get a true picture on comparing N you pretty well have to price it out on a per day basis. Some products are going to last much longer then others in which the percentage of N will have no control over.
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  #13  
Old 03-13-2008, 07:30 AM
bug-guy bug-guy is offline
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i have sold more 24 -2-11 than 16-0-8 this year by showing the customer the cost per 1000 is .30 cheaper per k
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  #14  
Old 03-13-2008, 10:00 AM
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rcreech rcreech is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golfguy View Post
I whole heartedly agree with grassmechanic. To base price solely on N is not really a true picture. To get a true picture on comparing N you pretty well have to price it out on a per day basis. Some products are going to last much longer then others in which the percentage of N will have no control over.
Again,

You have to be comparing the "same" type of product (SCU and quality) to price shop for N.

You may not always want to buy the cheapest source of N/1000, but if you have comparable product then that is where this comes in.
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  #15  
Old 03-13-2008, 11:36 AM
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RigglePLC RigglePLC is offline
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buy fert smart

Ok, experienced guys--good advice.

What is sulfer coated urea worth as compared to urea?

If you have 30-0-0 with 75 percent SCU, how much more is it worth than 30-0-0 with no SCU? Or with 25 percent SCU?

What about IBDU or methylene urea? PPSCU?

If nitrogen (as urea) is worth 75 cents per pound--how much is reasonable if it contains 30 percent SCU?
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  #16  
Old 03-13-2008, 12:35 PM
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boats47 boats47 is offline
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Urea is an organic compound (NH₂)₂CO, also known as Carbamide. Urea was one of the first organic compounds to be artificially synthesized from inorganic base materials, pretty cool I must say. You can also make it out of just about any mammal or amphibian pee (that’s a technical term). In our industry it produced from synthetic ammonia and carbon dioxide. Urea is the highest in Nitrogen content of all the solid formed nitrogenous fertilizers, and as I remember this did translate to lower costs (if that makes sense). Urea is very high in water solubility and that is why we use it in our fertilizers today and when we add sulfur to the equation it is our time release. So your, typically, 37-0-0 is 37% Nitrogen and I believe about 15-17% sulfur. This % of sulfur would higher with a fertilizer that is say 10% Nitrogen and give you a better time release (longer period of release). It also helps to protect the pure Urea found in the core of a granular of fertilizer. Companies also add sealants over the granular to aid in the time release process and to make the product more durable, that is why if you go with a cheap fert it very dusty.
I am not sure if this answered your question or not, but that is the gist of urea from what I remember….. I am sure one of old "timers" would answer this beter than me.
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  #17  
Old 03-13-2008, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RigglePLC View Post
Ok, experienced guys--good advice.

What is sulfer coated urea worth as compared to urea?

If you have 30-0-0 with 75 percent SCU, how much more is it worth than 30-0-0 with no SCU? Or with 25 percent SCU?

What about IBDU or methylene urea? PPSCU?

If nitrogen (as urea) is worth 75 cents per pound--how much is reasonable if it contains 30 percent SCU?
Very good questions!

I think it is hard to put a monetary value on SCU and slow release fert. I don't have a dollar figure but I look at SCU as a premium product with slower and extended feeding. I think it would be very difficult to compare a 25% SCU to a 50% SCU....but whatever the difference in price you just need to make sure that you are going to benefit from the added cost.

I went from 30% SCU this year to all 50% SCU on rounds 2 and 3. I didn't care about the price difference, because I wanted to extend my feeding a little longer. Still using a 30% product, just a little different SCU%. And it really didn't cost me very much more at all to go that way.
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  #18  
Old 03-14-2008, 07:30 PM
golfguy golfguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcreech View Post
Again,

You have to be comparing the "same" type of product (SCU and quality) to price shop for N.

You may not always want to buy the cheapest source of N/1000, but if you have comparable product then that is where this comes in.
I will leave it at disagree. If a product lasts longer on the ground that has the greatest potential in difference in cost.

Price per day method allows you to compare EVERY source of N straight up whether it is Ammonium Sulphate, Urea or Sulphur Coated Urea.
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  #19  
Old 03-14-2008, 11:13 PM
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rcreech rcreech is offline
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I agree with you...and I think we are saying the same thing!

But here is what I am saying:

If you are ONLY looking at the cost of N....then you will probably ALWAYS use urea. THIS IS A BAD IDEA! But if you are "price shopping" for a Nitrogen source that is comparable and what you need to use, then that is when you will compare price/N/1000.

Just like the 25%N SCU vs. 30%N SCU.

You can't really compare 46%N to any source containing SCU IMO. There is just no comparison!

As far as the length of feeding....I do think slow release is worth more, but as I stated previously, how do you put a monetary value on "length of feeding"?
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  #20  
Old 03-15-2008, 11:27 AM
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Harley-D Harley-D is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcreech View Post
If you are ONLY looking at the cost of N....then you will probably ALWAYS use urea. THIS IS A BAD IDEA! But if you are "price shopping" for a Nitrogen source that is comparable and what you need to use, then that is when you will compare price/N/1000.

Just like the 25%N SCU vs. 30%N SCU.

You can't really compare 46%N to any source containing SCU IMO. There is just no comparison!

As far as the length of feeding....I do think slow release is worth more, but as I stated previously, how do you put a monetary value on "length of feeding"?
I was just gonna say that if it is a controlled release, couldn't you determine the #N/App/Year? If you apply 4#N/year or so, that may be over 6 apps or 4 depending on the amount of slow release in each app. Or Form of N. Methylene Urea is bad a$$ IMO.

I would think that anyone would try and save themselves a whole round of apps if possible. How much time and gas does that save?
With prices where they are, everyone needs to seperate themselves from the competition by determining their cost per app, per M, per whatever and making their company more efficient. So...Apples to apples the only way to compare.

One other thing. Has anyone measured the distance between N prills when appling 34-3-11 at 3lb/n/k or less? IMO it's a little light. But you can't argue that a lb of N/k is a lb of N/k. 34-3-11 @ 3lbs or 24-5-11 @ 4lbs.
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