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  #11  
Old 02-01-2000, 02:47 PM
kountryscape kountryscape is offline
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Location: iowa
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boy somebody turn down the heat! i thought i was in the middle of a chevy ford thing or worse yet a dixie chopper exmark thing .. bottom line is we all make money in the great outdoors some of us want to find ways not to hurt it and some really dont care as long as the money is flowin. hey to each his own i think theres a fine line we have to walk ...... maybe it's being cooped up all winter?
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  #12  
Old 02-01-2000, 07:00 PM
SLSNursery SLSNursery is offline
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Location: West Haven, CT
Posts: 442
No kidding, turn down the heat. If we all did things the same way what fun would that be. I am licensed to apply pesticides, and also sell them. We apply and sell plenty of organics too to both high end customers and the not so high end ones. All of our services are based on IPM (Integrated Pest Management - see post from a couple of weeks ago). I offer options, and then prices. If someone (a homeowner or a commercial company) wants to find out about product or what else is available, I tell them all that I know. I base what I know on my results from actually using the different products. With all due respect to those who have differing opinions, Larry, I have even had success selling these organic types of products to municipal interests when the product suited their needs. Nothing is impossible, and as a trade we can stand to think globally, not locally. I even sell and spread products that are 50% organic, as an option - these products are usually avaible from local blenders, and work very well. We use a lot of Espoma organic products, ROOTS, and a general purpose fertilizer call Organi-Grow (5-5-0) which is similar to Milorganite. And, by the way, isn't lime organic? Synthetic products do provide controlled release, and I use plenty of them (we unload 22 tons of Scotts w/Pendi today), especially for weed and insect control in combo products. But, many times, for a straight feeding we will switch to something organic. How much 32-5-7 was spread during the last season in the summertime? Here in CT is was hot and dry. For those who watered, I selected and applied something a little more gentle. In closing, KUTTERS - You ought to try a few different products until you find some that work for you. As far as pricing, don't be intimidated by what others might suggest. Give the public some credit (not too much, though), and let them know why you charge more if you need more product and more labor. Don't put on blinders and simply do what the masses do. <p>----------<br>Phil Grande - Soundview Landscape Supply - http://members.aol.com/slsnursery<br>Ivy League Landscaping - http://members.aol.com/scagrider
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  #13  
Old 02-01-2000, 07:04 PM
KUTTERS KUTTERS is offline
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Location: Louisiana
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Hey thanks for all the input! My Opinion is organics work better than synthetic over the long run. A plant uses basic minerals at its simplest form. It dosen't care where it came from. Each person is entitled to his own opinion. <p>A soil that can produce or provide more basic minerals to a plant on its own is what I try to sell my customers. <p>I have clients who are willing to pay somewhat extra to use and organic material. <br>I am trying to find products at lower cost. Shipping cost or simply to much.
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  #14  
Old 02-01-2000, 08:02 PM
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lawrence stone lawrence stone is offline
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Location: anthracite valley, commonwealth of pennsylvania Winter residence: Charlotte County FLA
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Phil your points are well taken for you have<br>then needed education and have a logical thought process with the needed background<br>in math and chemistry. <p>All I was trying to do was educate the group<br>on the economics of orgainic materials.<br>If someone considers this an attack they<br>need to justify thier claim with facts not<br>just an emotional based thought process.<p>Right know I am working up a bid on a state<br>contract that requires a 50% 'natural' base.<br>They also want 500 lbs of pettlitized lime<br>applied per acre yearly. But since the job <br>(mowing, mulching, fertilizations, fall/spring clean up, and flower planting) totals 40 acres over 8 locations I have<br>no problem conformiing to those specs.<p>The best part about bidding large commercial<br>jobs is the non-licensed gypsy contractors<br>are not allowed to even bid on the job.<p>This is the only industry I know of that even<br>considers non-licensed contractors.<p>If your are an electrican or a plumber you<br>have to have a license to even be in business.<p>
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  #15  
Old 02-02-2000, 06:53 PM
moonarrow moonarrow is offline
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Location: Chatham, La. USA (northeast)
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a few points about organic ferts. the onger a property is on an organic program the less you need to fert. second every thing in a bag of organic fert is used by the plant or turf but in a bag of synthetic every thing in the bag is not used (inert mater for filler sometime this is hazardous waste allowed by our govern.) when your kid goes out and pulls up a blade of grass and puts in his or her mouth which do you want. for mosquitoes and other insects I have a formula I make at home for just a few pennies and can be bought comm. have a cust. that a farmer, sprayed his chems. on oranges and grapefruit to get rid of white flies did'nt work and asked me to help so I did he couldn't believe it. this is just my oppions good luck<p>----------<br>Dale moonarrow@hotmail.com<br>Southern lawn and Landscape
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  #16  
Old 02-02-2000, 07:59 PM
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lawrence stone lawrence stone is offline
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The first thing we need to do is replacing the word organic with &quot;natural&quot;. Every<br>product is organic.<p>Actually I only apply (if my specs are used) 2.5lbs of N per year at one half pound per application. Since I require of ALL of my<br>customers to buy a complete package my crew and I are mowing this turf and I reduce the<br>top growth as much as possible.<p>As far as your homemade mixes (ala jerry baker) go my commercial accounts,<br>school districts etc DEMAND a material<br>data safety sheet for all products used.<p>I have to address the concerns of MY business<br>in my local market. Someone suggested we<br>start thinking of the global market.<br>When I start producing revenue in the global<br>market I will take that into consideration.
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  #17  
Old 02-02-2000, 10:49 PM
moonarrow moonarrow is offline
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Location: Chatham, La. USA (northeast)
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lawarence, the mixtures I make at home can be bought commercially and do have MSDS forms on them the pesticide I use garlic and pepper tea, now being many cotton farmers and others and your are effecitng the global market every time it rains and your chemicial was down into the rivers and lakes that why Dallas, Tx. is trying to crack down on them they are the number one pollutant in the Trinity river coming from residintial and commercial properties. many state and national parks, now won't allow toxic chemicals. you need to check it out. times are changing the old ways are going to the wayside change with them. I'm not trying to be critical just trying to be informative and sometime we get set in our old ways that change is hard to except myself included. thank for your your input into the forum. see ya <p>----------<br>Dale moonarrow@hotmail.com<br>Southern lawn and Landscape
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  #18  
Old 02-02-2000, 11:13 PM
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lawrence stone lawrence stone is offline
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Dave,<p>Since when is Lesco 32-5-7 applied at<br>half rate considerd a toxic chemical?<p>Please back your statments up with some type<br>of facts from an independent source.<p>You are begining to sound like a person<br>who is listed in the pesticide hypersensitivity registry.
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  #19  
Old 02-02-2000, 11:21 PM
moonarrow moonarrow is offline
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lesco is a synthetically blended formula check the amount of inert matter in the bag the federal gov. alows this inert mater to consist of smal amounts of hazardous waste check it out<p>----------<br>Dale moonarrow@hotmail.com<br>Southern lawn and Landscape
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  #20  
Old 02-03-2000, 08:07 AM
SLSNursery SLSNursery is offline
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Larry - your points are well taken, because I have the necessary information to make decisions on which products to use. However, my statement about thinking globally did not apply directly to your effect upon the global market. I am simply suggesting that those folks who don't think that their work affects the world in which we live ought to step back and take a look around (in the general sense). Also, I figure that when a person asks for suggestions or ideas its because they want to learn, hopefully not just push an agenda. That's all, no hypersensitivity here. <p>----------<br>Phil Grande - Soundview Landscape Supply - http://members.aol.com/slsnursery<br>Ivy League Landscaping - http://members.aol.com/scagrider
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