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  #41  
Old 03-04-2009, 07:39 PM
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whoopassonthebluegrass whoopassonthebluegrass is offline
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NOTE: while I'm discussing this directly with Pete, anyone with any ideas/opinions outside of his, I'd still like to hear them!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
...The way Lesco/Cub Cadet plumbed it back into the Suction line is unfavorable design flaw IMO and will cause Cavation issues which will put unneeded extra stress on the Diaphrams. Remove 1/2' nipple and plug the hole near the filter, and reroute a longer hose to a Bulkhead and mount near the other 2 bulkheads on TOP of the tank.
So just have the bypass drop back into the tank then? You feel that'll alleviate some of the drama I'm dealing with?

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Originally Posted by heritage View Post
...The Bypass from the Pump can never have any restrictions between the pump and Tank.
Just trying to understand what's happening in the pump here - is it that the diaphragms are having to fight resistance as they push the fluids through, or what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
Before pulling the Trigger on a new D-30 you may want to change out the Diaphrams one last time and re-plumb as I suggest...
While this appeals to my pocketbook, I must confess that I'm fearful of putting my faith back into the D403... How strongly do you feel that this issue will be remedied via the replumbing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
...As well as change the Suction Filter to a 26 Mesh.
So just remove the existing unit and plumb the one in that you linked to? And once that's done, does that mean I'm gonna deal with massive clogs at my nozzle? Also, is it feasible to just purchase a different mesh for the existing filter?

Thanks.

Last edited by whoopassonthebluegrass; 03-04-2009 at 07:44 PM.
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  #42  
Old 03-04-2009, 08:40 PM
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whoopassonthebluegrass whoopassonthebluegrass is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLWC View Post
hay woop do you use pendulum in your mix it will destroy your rubber diaphragm
Thanks for the input. I only run prodiamine.
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  #43  
Old 03-04-2009, 09:55 PM
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RigglePLC RigglePLC is online now
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I think Pete is right. He sounds like the voice of experience. The way Lesco routed the pressure dump bypass flow, back to just in front of the filter--is a bad idea--and another reason--when you are not spraying, the fluid going around and around endlessly heats up. It may exceed the safe working temperature of the diaphragms. Make sure you are using the genuine "Desmopan" diaphragms, not the ordinary cheap black rubber diaphragms. Esters and warm water temps are harder on the diaphragms.

What speed is the motor running? Is the Kawi at max? If you don't need high pressure half throttle may be enough--and easier on the pump.

My setup sends the bypass flow back into the agitation line using a Tee fitting. Works fine. There is not much restriction in this return line, in my setup (I use four spraying systems agitation booster nozzles. (I use Hypro D252 pump --6 gal per min).

Brass and galvanized iron have not caused any problems in my setup.

I use a 325 mesh filter screen in front of the pump. Have a hundred mesh pre-filter inside the tank.

I use a spraying systems pressure relief valve with stainless steel seats--it 's better.
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  #44  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:10 PM
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heritage heritage is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whoopassonthebluegrass View Post
NOTE: while I'm discussing this directly with Pete, anyone with any ideas/opinions outside of his, I'd still like to hear them!!



So just have the bypass drop back into the tank then? You feel that'll alleviate some of the drama I'm dealing with?

I believe it will indeed.

Just trying to understand what's happening in the pump here - is it that the diaphragms are having to fight resistance as they push the fluids through, or what?

I feel that the cavatation that takes place where the current bypass return line plumbs in, has a drastic effect on the flow to the pump, causing "Pulses" that cause an erratic flow.....The diaphrams take the brunt.


While this appeals to my pocketbook, I must confess that I'm fearful of putting my faith back into the D403... How strongly do you feel that this issue will be remedied via the replumbing?


Pretty strongly. This and the filter is what I would change. I say go for it, one last shot Before you spend on a D-30. If or when you put a D-30 on that gearbox, it mounts Perpendicular to the box whereas the 403 runs parallel with the box....You will have to move the suction filter mount as well as the reel motor to make the D-30 fit proper.


So just remove the existing unit and plumb the one in that you linked to? And once that's done, does that mean I'm gonna deal with massive clogs at my nozzle? Also, is it feasible to just purchase a different mesh for the existing filter?

Rittenhouse has YOUR filter with a 20 Mesh option if you want to stick with that clear housing, BUT they do not offer the 20 mesh screen only....You have to but the entire filter.

Also what size spray nozzle?? For Turf??? Green...Yellow...Blue Lesco???

I like a smaller 50-100 mesh as a 2nd filter on the pressure side when using small turf flood nozzles. Not an issue for the pump AND not an issue for the low volume spray as pressures are below 100psi.

Thanks.
I hope that make it more clear to you Whoop.

Also remember that the 20 mesh or the 16 mesh if you go with the TeeJet Suction filter, allow better flow and clog far LESS. THIS relieves a LOT of stress on the Diaghprams as well as fixing that Bypass line corectly.

Pete
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  #45  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:21 PM
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whoopassonthebluegrass whoopassonthebluegrass is offline
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So if I reroute the bypass into the tank, could I just tie mine into the existing agitation line, too? Or would I need to increase the diameter of the agitation plumbing to prevent the same problem occurring on the way back down into the tank?
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  #46  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:31 PM
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heritage heritage is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RigglePLC View Post
I think Pete is right. He sounds like the voice of experience. The way Lesco routed the pressure dump bypass flow, back to just in front of the filter--is a bad idea--and another reason--when you are not spraying, the fluid going around and around endlessly heats up. It may exceed the safe working temperature of the diaphragms. Make sure you are using the genuine "Desmopan" diaphragms, not the ordinary cheap black rubber diaphragms. Esters and warm water temps are harder on the diaphragms.

What speed is the motor running? Is the Kawi at max? If you don't need high pressure half throttle may be enough--and easier on the pump.

My setup sends the bypass flow back into the agitation line using a Tee fitting. Works fine. There is not much restriction in this return line, in my setup (I use four spraying systems agitation booster nozzles. (I use Hypro D252 pump --6 gal per min).

Brass and galvanized iron have not caused any problems in my setup.

I use a 325 mesh filter screen in front of the pump. Have a hundred mesh pre-filter inside the tank.

I use a spraying systems pressure relief valve with stainless steel seats--it 's better.
Riggle,

More good points, great.

I only run the throttle about 3/4 full with everything except wettable powders and Nitroform Powder Blue....With those I need ALL 9 or so of the GPM of the D-30 in a 300 Gal tank, as well as my Supermix Agitator on a pressure line, to keep in suspension.

So running full throttle otherwise IMO is overkill.

The Spraying Systems Pressure Relief Valve is a great option as far as wear is concerned. The Stock Valve that Comes on the D-30 has the "Hockey Puck" that you access by removing the 2 bolts to change. If you use abrasive materials, and you have lost pressure, but it's not erratic at the pressure gauge, from a worn valve and seat or some crud in between, you can bet that hockey puck has a big Divot worn into it. Riggle's switch is a good option if you have dedicated the sprayer for either High pressure Ornamental OR Just Turf and low pressure Ornamental spraying as with the 0-300 psi option Relief valve you can't run over 300 psi and with the 300-700psi Relief valve, you won't be able to run low pressure Turf, because you will not have enough sensitivity, and too heavy spring.

Agree with the Better Diaphram option also, an also point out NON-DETERGENT OIL to Whoop.......Did you know that one Whoop......It's in the Manual. The Detergent also break down the Rubbers.


Good discusssion for the Hypro Pump Users.

Pete
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  #47  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:33 PM
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whoopassonthebluegrass whoopassonthebluegrass is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
Rittenhouse has YOUR filter with a 20 Mesh option if you want to stick with that clear housing, BUT they do not offer the 20 mesh screen only....You have to but the entire filter.
As I was putting the sprayer together for those pix, I found that my strainer glass is cracked internally all the way around. So maybe it's time to replace it, anyhow. I like the comfort of seeing that filter anytime I am over at the pump and motor. I think I'll try the same unit with the 20 mesh... Is this the unit you were referencing?

http://www.rittenhouse.ca/asp/Product.asp?PG=2179 (the $42.08 choice)

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
Also what size spray nozzle?? For Turf??? Green...Yellow...Blue Lesco???
I've been running the yellow 2GPM nozzle. I use this setup strictly for turf.

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
I like a smaller 50-100 mesh as a 2nd filter on the pressure side when using small turf flood nozzles. Not an issue for the pump AND not an issue for the low volume spray as pressures are below 100psi.
That sounds nice. I clog my nozzle quite frequently. Where in the assembly do you have it connected? Just prior to the reel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
I hope that make it more clear to you Whoop.
So far so good. I wouldn't say I'm out of the woods yet, but I genuinely appreciate all the help thus far.
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  #48  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:35 PM
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whoopassonthebluegrass whoopassonthebluegrass is offline
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I always run the Desmopan diaphragms and SAE30 Non-detergent oil.
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  #49  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:44 PM
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heritage heritage is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whoopassonthebluegrass View Post
So if I reroute the bypass into the tank, could I just tie mine into the existing agitation line, too? Or would I need to increase the diameter of the agitation plumbing to prevent the same problem occurring on the way back down into the tank?
Whoop.

No. Leave those alone. That line that returns to the tank/jet agitation is on a PRESSURE line of the Pump itself. This won't hurt the Diaphrams, and you will get better mixing/suspension with that setup.

You will need to Buy a Bulkhead of proper size. I will look up what you need and post for you.

When your bulkhead comes in the mail, you will take it to a Hardware Store to buy the Correct Size Hole Cutter, and then mount near the existing 2 bulkheads where the pressure line agitation and the Suction to pump hose is mounted on top of the Tank.......It's EASY to do and it wont leak as the Bulkhead screws together like a sandwich with a rubber gasket between.

Then just put a nylon plug where you remove the existing 3/8 hose that goes from the pump bypass to the manifold near the filter.

You will also need a longer 3/8 hose to run from the Pump to the new bulkhead /fitting you add to the top of the tank....That is the Pump "Bypass" and should have no resistance.

It won't be hard to do. I will get some links on here for you for parts.

Pete
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  #50  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:53 PM
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whoopassonthebluegrass whoopassonthebluegrass is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
You will need to Buy a Bulkhead of proper size. I will look up what you need and post for you.
I was eyeballing these ones earlier:

http://www.turfeagle.com/products/product1204.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
When your bulkhead comes in the mail, you will take it to a Hardware Store to buy the Correct Size Hole Cutter, and then mount near the existing 2 bulkheads where the pressure line agitation and the Suction to pump hose is mounted on top of the Tank.......It's EASY to do and it wont leak as the Bulkhead screws together like a sandwich with a rubber gasket between.
Actually, wood bits (spade bits for larger sizes) bore through the tank with incredible ease, and accuracy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by heritage View Post
You will also need a longer 3/8 hose to run from the Pump to the new bulkhead /fitting you add to the top of the tank....That is the Pump "Bypass" and should have no resistance.
Should I run something bigger than 3/8"?? The original line there was a 1" hose.

Thanks.
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