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  #11  
Old 03-16-2009, 07:12 PM
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bicmudpuppy bicmudpuppy is offline
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I haven't taken a picture yet. Spring is here. Hopefully, I will get a picture tomorrow.
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  #12  
Old 03-17-2009, 06:53 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bicmudpuppy View Post
... We would do a light lime dusting with drop spreaders at the very first sign of disease. This is on bentgrass greens in KY, The Ohio River Valley (90%+ Humidity year round). ...
... A light dose of fertilizer has the same affect. ...
Sounds like an article I just read in another thread.
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
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  #13  
Old 03-17-2009, 01:58 PM
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JDUtah JDUtah is offline
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To me, snow in that circumstance would have acted as an insulator... might be because the microbes froze without the snow covering...

again i said might.
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  #14  
Old 03-17-2009, 02:24 PM
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bicmudpuppy bicmudpuppy is offline
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Originally Posted by JDUtah View Post
To me, snow in that circumstance would have acted as an insulator... might be because the microbes froze without the snow covering...

again i said might.
I've been SCREAMING "might" since before the event. They insisted on shoveling more greens later. It seemed a waste of labor and bad for me agronomically, not to wait until things started to melt. They skinned greens down to the crowns in places with the edge of the shovels, etc. The first app of molasses and ammonium sulfate with green indicator dye made all the "scuff" marks glow almost a neon. Really made the damage seem pronounced. Most of that has recovered already. We are getting grass off of them. Not as much as I would really like, but they are growing. I am pretty sure, with 70+degree days all this week, that we will still aerate, starting Monday.

Now, pictures of the poor turf. I took a plug off it after taking the pictures. Very little green in the plug. You have to look for it in the crowns, BUT the crowns and roots seem to be alive. I *think* it may come out of it. Doubting now that it was the molasses.
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  #15  
Old 03-17-2009, 08:40 PM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
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Originally Posted by JDUtah View Post
To me, snow in that circumstance would have acted as an insulator... might be because the microbes froze without the snow covering...

again i said might.
I often wondered if it was true in other parts of the world. When there is a 'cold front' approaching us it is usually preceded with some form of precipitation. If the High Pressure is dry then we have a buffer for the soil to protect it from 'Dry'.
If the High Pressure goes below 0 degrees F. it is usually preceded by some form of precipitation. Normally it is like you say - an insulating layer. Otherwise we would have frost 11' into the ground, every year.

I have been 'blowdrying' my smaller lawns as I clean them up. When I do they dry up and thaw out more quickly. When the next snow comes - it will soak into the ground as it 'warms up' again. Meanwhile, other uncared for spot will continue to puddle and wash when it warms up.

I'm with bicm., "Don't shovel snow off the grass."

That does bring up another question: What about the ice?

Does spring time ice suffocate grass, when the grass should still be dormant? [we are about 4" thick of ice under the snow piles.]
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
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  #16  
Old 03-17-2009, 08:47 PM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
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[QUOTE=bicmudpuppy;2859266] ... I am pretty sure, with 70+degree days all this week, that we will still aerate, starting Monday. ... [QUOTE]

So are you aerating for the purpose of overseeding?
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
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  #17  
Old 03-17-2009, 09:17 PM
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bicmudpuppy bicmudpuppy is offline
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[QUOTE=Smallaxe;2860104][QUOTE=bicmudpuppy;2859266] ... I am pretty sure, with 70+degree days all this week, that we will still aerate, starting Monday. ...
Quote:

So are you aerating for the purpose of overseeding?
No, bentgrass is a creeping variety and when forced to grow at the levels we ask it to perform at, thatch is a progressive problem. Also, because the turf is under constant stress, opening up the soil profile to allow good air and water exchange becomes an issue. Not to mention the foot and mower traffic on a daily basis helping with compaction. Budget and available quality sand limit what I can do easily, but in a opportunistic situation, I would aerify three times during the growing season. The middle aerification might be solid tines to prevent undue stress from the heat. I would also vertical mow (verticut) in two directions every four weeks with a light top dressing every other week. Top dressing is normally sand, but many will use a "greens mix" which would mean a peat moss or similar substrate added to the sand to help with moisture and soil structure. This would be an ideal time to mix in some compost imo. The bentgrass will excel and actually over perform with intense cultivation.
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  #18  
Old 03-17-2009, 09:22 PM
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bicmudpuppy bicmudpuppy is offline
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Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
That does bring up another question: What about the ice?

Does spring time ice suffocate grass, when the grass should still be dormant? [we are about 4" thick of ice under the snow piles.]
For greens, the point where the ice becomes an issue depends on the variety. Many northern courses are overrun with poa annua and poa trivialis as a weed in the putting surface. This weed has become so prolific and adapted to the HOC on putting surfaces that many have opted to manage the weed. Poa will begin to desiccate if under ice for around 45 days. Bentgrass will reliably survive for around 60 days. In areas where the ice would never last that long (like my situation here), instead of using covers to protect from dry, frigid conditions, it is not uncommon to "ice" greens prior to a cold front moving in. This is one of my least favorite tasks. Getting wet when the temperatures are at or near freezing is just not fun, BUT the ice will insulate the ground from the dessication that will occur when temperatures and wind chills plummet.

Almost forgot, if the ice becomes a prolonged thing and your worried about it, any dark substance like Milorganite or similar bio-solid will melt through the ice to allow air exchange to begin again. Black sand or cinders work as well, but might be more messy. Synthetic ferts are NOT recommended. They dissolve and run to central spots and will then burn the turf.
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  #19  
Old 03-17-2009, 10:14 PM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
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[QUOTE=bicmudpuppy;2860215][QUOTE=Smallaxe;2860104]
Quote:
Originally Posted by bicmudpuppy View Post
... I am pretty sure, with 70+degree days all this week, that we will still aerate, starting Monday. ...

No, bentgrass is a creeping variety and when forced to grow at the levels we ask it to perform at, thatch is a progressive problem. ...
So could you be saying that your 'green care practices' , which makes the grass 'perform' - may be causing 'thatch'?

That is why you would do a spring 'Aeration'? for thatch?

What do you think about spring aeration and spring overseeding?
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
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  #20  
Old 03-18-2009, 12:05 AM
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bicmudpuppy bicmudpuppy is offline
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[QUOTE=Smallaxe;2860488][QUOTE=bicmudpuppy;2860215]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post

So could you be saying that your 'green care practices' , which makes the grass 'perform' - may be causing 'thatch'?

That is why you would do a spring 'Aeration'? for thatch?

What do you think about spring aeration and spring overseeding?
Pushing a grass that propagates readily from stolons and rhizomes (brain dead tonight and don't remember which is primary for bentgrass, sorry) increases the thatch layer. Southern climates have zoysia, bermuda, St. Augustine, and a few others that have similar habit and aggressiveness. Bentgrass is the only one I know of that survives northern climates. Upper end budgets will aerify even more than the 2-3 times per year I would prefer. I also don't do pre-m on greens. They are aggressive enough that a weed as coarse as crab doesn't have a chance in most situations. Even with mechanical cultivation monthly!

Now, spring seeding and aerification............it CAN work. I don't like spring seeding. If the turf is thick enough, spring aerification can really make a big difference in the turf getting a jump on summer and helping it to compete and choke out the other undesirables. Good, thick KB would be an excellent example. If your turf is thin enough to need seed, then the weeds are going to germ too, BUT if that is your best choice, double the rate and do everything you can to kick start the grass seed. Toma used to give a great speech about how to soak KB or rye and pre-germinate the seed prior to planting. Mixing a pre-germ'd seed w/ compost and casting it would be an interesting thing to see. All things being equal, I will seed in the fall. Again, after saying all that, my fert didn't get ordered in time last fall and I there fore didn't get my seed down, so I'm going to slit seed 2000# of KB over the next two weeks in my rough and another 200#'s on my tees. We will start aerifing tees tomorrow. We will drag the cores and top dress with about 1/8th" of sand, seed and re-drag.
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