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Old 07-16-2009, 12:37 PM
yardmonkey yardmonkey is offline
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Best as I can tell so far (and no one really knows yet) autism is caused by injecting vaccines containing mercury (and/or other toxins) into infants at certain ages when certain parts of the brain are developing. There may be no "cure", but some claim to have reversed the problem by various means, including chelation therapy to remove heavy metals. But as far as we know, autistic children are no more or less sensitive to various "chemicals" than anyone else. It would not be good for anyone to have a drink of Trimec, but if you carefully spray trimec on some clover patches, this should have no way of affecting their child unless he goes out and eats some of the clover right after you spray it. All the herbicides are different, but most will be broken down within days or weeks of use.

So you can solve the clover problem with $1.00 worth of chemical, or it could cost hundreds to use other means, such as removing and replacing soil or trying to gradually change the lawn. But of course it will be beneficial to treat the lawn well organically anyway.

These people may be a pain. But you may be able to explain some options, and maybe they can be less picky and more patient. Corn gluten meal, is very high in nitrogen, so it might be good to treat with CGM, like lots of it, many times a year, and see if this helps with the clover. It is expensive, but it should be good for the lawn anyway. Might even prevent some annual weeds.
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Old 07-16-2009, 05:07 PM
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hunter hunter is offline
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You can try a product called weed pharm from Now it is 20% acetic acid which is vinegar. Any time you use an acetic acid it will lower the ph in the soil.
But then again it is non-selective.
I don't believe too much in looking back. If you've done well, you're too inclined to become smug. If you've done poorly, you're inclined to become discouraged. Keep looking ahead - yesterday's done with - think about today and tomorrow. - George S. May
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Old 07-21-2009, 06:06 PM
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muddstopper muddstopper is offline
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Build your client a portable chicken tractor and fill it with egg laying hens. Move the pen daily around the lawn. The clover will disappear and your customer will get a fresh supply og eggs as well as free orgainic fertilizer.
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Old 07-21-2009, 11:03 PM
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soloscaperman soloscaperman is offline
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I would ditch the customer if there being a pain I have a woman that is always freaking out when her kid walks outside omg the world is full of chemicals. It's not worth wasting time on a customer like this.
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Old 07-22-2009, 09:12 AM
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terrapro terrapro is offline
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Originally Posted by JDUtah View Post
Lol, gotta love ignorance. Everything you eat is and contains chemicals. Food is full of enzymes and assembled molecules (chemicals). Some pesticides are just enzymes as well. Heck, I guess you could say the autism is caused by chemicals. The chemicals that make up the child (and his/her brain) are not working like they should. Lol, poor kid. If "chemicals" are the problem you need to ship him/her to the only place that chemicals don't exist. The abys called outer space.

Lol but more seriously... Like Yardmonkey hinted I was joking about the vinegar. The lawn would be dead half the year. And even more seriously... if you are dealing with a potential customer that is that ignorant... RUN! If you don't you will wish you did. This sounds like one of those, "I will look it up on the internet and trust the first thing I read" customers. They are not good customers!

Just my .02

There is also a fungi that apparently attacks various weeds coming out of Canada... but I wouldn't use it yet. It has not had NEAR enough testing. You might be avoiding man made chemicals only to expose the autistic child to more serious chemicals, spores, and enzymes that come form the fungi. Again, I would walk away.
Personally you would be the ignorant one. Autism is not funny and when you see one of you're children disappearing mentally before your eyes one week after getting a vaccination you come to me and tell me how it happened. Trying anything you can do to help a child is worth it.

Toxins are generally the cause not "chemicals".

Just because you learned it in your applicators classes doesn't mean it is the truth. Like Yardmonkey said we used to put clover in with grass seed years ago why can't any other practiced be deemed incorrect when new knowledge has been discovered.

Here in the organic forum our cultural practices lean towards sustainablility and understanding agricultural science. We understand and accept some pretty crazy ideas about the soil that people say in the "icide" forums can't and won't grasp. Why can't there be something about the human anatomy you don't understand?

Again, not funny.
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Old 07-25-2009, 11:30 AM
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upidstay upidstay is offline
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You'll never be rid of clover. Ever. Clover seeds can remain viable in the soil for over 20 years, and all it takes is one. One pound of clover seed is literally millions of seeds. If they want to get ris of clover, you'll hafta spray it with an herbicide. All of the efrective "organic" herbicides are burn downs, which will kill the grass too. I have not heard anything good about the green guardian "natural broadleaf herbicide". Have not used it myself, but from what I've read it is very, very expensive, hard to use without burning the grass too, and is just not all that effective. I believe it has 7 or 8 weeds on the label. Spray it with something containing dicamba and be done with it. Whenever you see it, spot spray it before it takes over. I like Momentum or Eliminate-D for clover.
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Old 07-25-2009, 05:36 PM
sjessen sjessen is online now
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If it is a small area would the customer consider solarizing the soil by laying plastic, etc. on the ground for a few days and kill everything and later reseed?
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Old 07-27-2009, 06:08 PM
cudaclan cudaclan is offline
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Why fight something that is beneficial? Solve the problem by broadcasting clover (white) seeds. As a homeowner, I broad-casted a substantial amount of clover (red & white) last year. If I had to do it again I would opt with red clover. They tend to have smaller and greener leaves. I plan to top-dress compost mixed with clover again this year. It has almost eliminated the weeds and maintains constant growth. I encourage any homeowner that reads these forums to not deter clover. Instead, choose clover as your primary lawn (zone dependent) next to xerogardening.
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Old 07-27-2009, 09:59 PM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is offline
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Around here - Red Cover - gets Stemmy and too tall. Yellow Cover is to invasive and hugs the ground too tightly to feel good under your feet. It tends to be 'dirty' after a rain. White clover is my favorite. It would be perfect in a 'NoMow' fescue lawn.
Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
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Old 07-28-2009, 07:19 PM
dishboy dishboy is offline
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Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
Around here - Red Cover - gets Stemmy and too tall. Yellow Cover is to invasive and hugs the ground too tightly to feel good under your feet. It tends to be 'dirty' after a rain. White clover is my favorite. It would be perfect in a 'NoMow' fescue lawn.
Around here white clover is considered a weed and not desired in any lawn other than old hippies who think a weedy , non-maintained landscape is "loving your mother".
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