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  #191  
Old 03-15-2011, 09:14 PM
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SVA_Concrete SVA_Concrete is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DVS Hardscaper View Post
Naturally, you're not expected to be in the welding and fabricating business.

When I see pics of lead steps that do not meet code, well......I don't think I need to say what goes through my mind. You already know......






,

a picture is worth a thousand words.

in dvs' picture i see a few things that I would like the mention

1. can a 6" sphere fit through the triangle area between the riser tread and bottom rail-- maybe? i cant tell measurements from this photo, but it looks rather large and not in compliance with the building code-----HOWEVER, a guard system is not required by the IRC in this instance due to the fact that the elevation of the landing is (assuming on my part) less than 30 inches from the adjacent grade.

2. it doesn't appear that there is proper flashing against the house where the porch meets the vinyl siding. the correct flashing detail is for the siding to be removed and a waterproof barrier (grace vycor or similar) be installed and then the siding j channeled around the area with the j-channel taped to the moisture barrier of the home (or a piece of metal flashing).

the same goes for Mr. G, the piece of (apparently) pvc trim at the bottom of the door, was that flashed properly? i dont know, i would ask the question though.

secondly in reference to mr. g: i don't like how the bottom of the lowest step is bearing at the finished grade, i would stack that bottom stone on top of a buried stone so that the bearing elevation of that stone will not be disturbed during the installation of a finished walking surface. as well as preventing loads from the step from being transferred into the walk surface.

personally i don't think that glue is needed, go lift your granite counter tops, yes you can lift them, they are not glued down, gravity and friction are natural adhesives that work well with heavy objects. lego blocks are rather light and small in size requiring the use of additional glue.

come to think of it i wonder if there was pl landscape glue around when Stonehenge was assembled. kinda one of those "you need this" thing.

Finally, regarding the railings on mr. g's steps. first set of steps needs ONE rail on ONE side with no gards. the second set needs ONE rail on ONE side that becomes a guard system at the 4th step and continues on the landing, also it needs a gard system on the 4th step and on the landing on the opposite site----- clear as mud?
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  #192  
Old 03-15-2011, 09:30 PM
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zedosix zedosix is offline
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There is a product called butyl tape, I've talked about it before on here I think. It would work fantastic for that. One bead on the perimeter and it won't move. It would be the easiest way to adhere it. I don't know how well pl would hold up on something that size.
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  #193  
Old 03-15-2011, 09:30 PM
scagrider22 scagrider22 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SVA_Concrete View Post
a picture is worth a thousand words.

in dvs' picture i see a few things that I would like the mention

1. can a 6" sphere fit through the triangle area between the riser tread and bottom rail-- maybe? i cant tell measurements from this photo, but it looks rather large and not in compliance with the building code-----HOWEVER, a guard system is not required by the IRC in this instance due to the fact that the elevation of the landing is (assuming on my part) less than 30 inches from the adjacent grade.

2. it doesn't appear that there is proper flashing against the house where the porch meets the vinyl siding. the correct flashing detail is for the siding to be removed and a waterproof barrier (grace vycor or similar) be installed and then the siding j channeled around the area with the j-channel taped to the moisture barrier of the home (or a piece of metal flashing).

the same goes for Mr. G, the piece of (apparently) pvc trim at the bottom of the door, was that flashed properly? i dont know, i would ask the question though.

secondly in reference to mr. g: i don't like how the bottom of the lowest step is bearing at the finished grade, i would stack that bottom stone on top of a buried stone so that the bearing elevation of that stone will not be disturbed during the installation of a finished walking surface. as well as preventing loads from the step from being transferred into the walk surface.

personally i don't think that glue is needed, go lift your granite counter tops, yes you can lift them, they are not glued down, gravity and friction are natural adhesives that work well with heavy objects. lego blocks are rather light and small in size requiring the use of additional glue.

come to think of it i wonder if there was pl landscape glue around when Stonehenge was assembled. kinda one of those "you need this" thing.

Finally, regarding the railings on mr. g's steps. first set of steps needs ONE rail on ONE side with no gards. the second set needs ONE rail on ONE side that becomes a guard system at the 4th step and continues on the landing, also it needs a gard system on the 4th step and on the landing on the opposite site----- clear as mud?
You must not live in a northern climate, the freeze and thaw will easily move those steps. Especially because they are not buried below grade.
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  #194  
Old 03-15-2011, 09:47 PM
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SVA_Concrete SVA_Concrete is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scagrider22 View Post
You must not live in a northern climate, the freeze and thaw will easily move those steps. Especially because they are not buried below grade.
you are correct, I do not live in a northern climate, I thank God im a southern coastal boy we generally don't freeze much down here for very long.

i suppose i should retract the frost heaving issue?

in theory though, what about your retaining walls? do you glue every block? frost will heave that as well....no?

i suppose the concern is not settling back correctly? uneven gaps etc.
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  #195  
Old 03-15-2011, 10:00 PM
scagrider22 scagrider22 is offline
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The freeze and thaw will move the OP's steps. They may not move alot but it will be enough to throw off all the seems between blocks.

The retaining walls hold up pretty well if they are installed correctly, I dont glue any of the block but I do glue the caps.
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  #196  
Old 03-15-2011, 10:53 PM
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TomG TomG is offline
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SVA-The PVC kick plate was properly flashed by a carpenter. I would say about 70% of the jobs we do where we rip off an old set of steps the kick plate and all the wood behind it is rotted and needs to be replaced. So we call our carpenter and he replaces all the wood parts that need to be replaced and flashes and waterproofs everything. Also you are correct in regards to the railing placement.

Glue or adhesive is NOT needed at all. We do use it on about 2% of our stoops but I don't believe in giving out all our secrets so I wont say where we use it. But it is not for structural support. The base will not move (maybe a little) if constructed and compacted properly. Also there is no glue to my knowledge that will hold this much weight together. So any normal glue like the stuff you use to glue wall cap will just come apart if the steps do move, hence its useless. Think about it on a stoop with 5, 6' steps and a 6' x 4' pad, like in my last set of pictures there is a total of 7700lbs pushing down on the bottom 2 fillers.

And if that doesn't convince some of you... our supplier of granite also installs granite stoops (some companies don't have the machinery to lift the granite) doesn't use glue and they have been in business since 1883. So you should take their word even over mine.
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  #197  
Old 03-16-2011, 07:03 PM
NEUSWEDE NEUSWEDE is offline
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Tom,

Looks good, I agree with you, why would you use adhesive? I have done several over the past 7 years and none of them have moved or shift at all. These are pretty heavy espically that top landing.
We use Swensons Granite, I know they have places in NH as well. Instead of using a mallett I use a thin board off of like a pallett and set the front on that to get the straps out and then push the board up and slides the top piece back and drops it down. Didn't come up with it myself learned from the driver about 4 years ago. I have them set all the easy ones easily accessable because the guy can set it in a hurray.

keep up the great work
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  #198  
Old 03-16-2011, 07:58 PM
PatriotLandscape PatriotLandscape is offline
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Swenson is great their drivers do a great job setting the stones.

Those granite pieces will not move no adhesive is needed.

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  #199  
Old 03-16-2011, 08:13 PM
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DVS Hardscaper DVS Hardscaper is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SVA_Concrete View Post
a picture is worth a thousand words.

in dvs' picture i see a few things that I would like the mention

1. can a 6" sphere fit through the triangle area between the riser tread and bottom rail-- maybe? i cant tell measurements from this photo, but it looks rather large and not in compliance with the building code-----HOWEVER, a guard system is not required by the IRC in this instance due to the fact that the elevation of the landing is (assuming on my part) less than 30 inches from the adjacent grade.

2. it doesn't appear that there is proper flashing against the house where the porch meets the vinyl siding. the correct flashing detail is for the siding to be removed and a waterproof barrier (grace vycor or similar) be installed and then the siding j channeled around the area with the j-channel taped to the moisture barrier of the home (or a piece of metal flashing).

the same goes for Mr. G, the piece of (apparently) pvc trim at the bottom of the door, was that flashed properly? i dont know, i would ask the question though.

secondly in reference to mr. g: i don't like how the bottom of the lowest step is bearing at the finished grade, i would stack that bottom stone on top of a buried stone so that the bearing elevation of that stone will not be disturbed during the installation of a finished walking surface. as well as preventing loads from the step from being transferred into the walk surface.

personally i don't think that glue is needed, go lift your granite counter tops, yes you can lift them, they are not glued down, gravity and friction are natural adhesives that work well with heavy objects. lego blocks are rather light and small in size requiring the use of additional glue.

come to think of it i wonder if there was pl landscape glue around when Stonehenge was assembled. kinda one of those "you need this" thing.

Finally, regarding the railings on mr. g's steps. first set of steps needs ONE rail on ONE side with no gards. the second set needs ONE rail on ONE side that becomes a guard system at the 4th step and continues on the landing, also it needs a gard system on the 4th step and on the landing on the opposite site----- clear as mud?

Thanks for the concern(s) SVA, but she's built ship tight!


#1 - handrails/safety rails are required. And complied.

#2 - flashin. siding. water. all is well And there is a reason why all is well


,
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  #200  
Old 03-16-2011, 09:10 PM
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SVA_Concrete SVA_Concrete is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DVS Hardscaper View Post
Thanks for the concern(s) SVA, but she's built ship tight!


#1 - handrails/safety rails are required. And complied.

#2 - flashin. siding. water. all is well And there is a reason why all is well


,

1. I assumed the steps at 7 inches, in that case no GUARD is required, a handrail IS required however -- because of the 4 rise qualifier. This is based on the 2006 IRC code.

2. do you care to share how flashing is properly installed, once again i am going off the photo that shows no drainage flashing that i can see.
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