Register free!
Search
 
     

Click for Weather
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 08-31-2011, 11:15 AM
fl-landscapes's Avatar
fl-landscapes fl-landscapes is offline
LawnSite Silver Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: SW Florida
Posts: 2,296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
Does the plant require photosynthesis in the fall to utilize any NPK that is in the soil?
Or can it still utilize NPK w/out photosynethesizing it?
from what i know turf will uptake nutrients and store as carbohydrates all the way to soil temps just above freezing. It utilizes it in more root groowth and less top growth due to the plants slowing the photosythesis down with low temps and less sunlight each day. once the ground freezes metobolism stops the plant goes dormant and wont uptake anything. So as long as "in the fall" doesnt mean frozen ground it will utilize npk.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-31-2011, 02:30 PM
Ric's Avatar
Ric Ric is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: S W Florida
Posts: 10,973
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
Does the plant require photosynthesis in the fall to utilize any NPK that is in the soil?
Or can it still utilize NPK w/out photosynethesizing it?
Smallaxe

One of the big problems in the Green Industry is lack of understanding 8th grade plant Biology. Fertilizers are Minerals or inorganic elements that Plant convert to sugars that feed them. This process takes Energy which in the case of Plants is supplied by the sun in a process called photosynthesis.
__________________
.

"TG doesn't give a rats ass about being "Responsible" as long as sales/production quotas are met. That's it in a nutshell. A recipe for disaster IMO." Ted Putnam 2/28/14

You can lead a Donkey to water but you can't make the Jackass Drink

"As Americans you have the right to be stupid." John Kerry

"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-31-2011, 05:32 PM
countryclublawnllc's Avatar
countryclublawnllc countryclublawnllc is offline
LawnSite Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Michigan
Posts: 119
Smallaxe

Into the fall/winter season depending on location etc. the plant will still be photosynthesizing utilizing the suns energy. The energy that it converts from the sun and turns into usable sugars and storable carbohydrates will give it better winter hardiness, root growth, as well as enhancing spring greenup. A good study was done in the mid 80's out of Ohio State that showed the benefits of late fall feeding. As stated above the plant will take up energy either through the shoots or roots as fall progresses, up until close to frozen ground occurs. The later the fertilizing the more it would be preferred to use readily available nitrogen sources opposed. I have always had a good response from the ammonium sulfate products later in the fall or early in the spring but if soil temps are still decent urea would be a cheaper source and still very effective. Here's a link to an article that summarizes the study:

http://turfdisease.osu.edu/turf-dise...-fertilization

John
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-31-2011, 05:59 PM
Ric's Avatar
Ric Ric is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: S W Florida
Posts: 10,973
Quote:
Originally Posted by countryclublawnllc View Post
Smallaxe

Into the fall/winter season depending on location etc. the plant will still be photosynthesizing utilizing the suns energy. The energy that it converts from the sun and turns into usable sugars and storable carbohydrates will give it better winter hardiness, root growth, as well as enhancing spring greenup. A good study was done in the mid 80's out of Ohio State that showed the benefits of late fall feeding. As stated above the plant will take up energy either through the shoots or roots as fall progresses, up until close to frozen ground occurs. The later the fertilizing the more it would be preferred to use readily available nitrogen sources opposed. I have always had a good response from the ammonium sulfate products later in the fall or early in the spring but if soil temps are still decent urea would be a cheaper source and still very effective. Here's a link to an article that summarizes the study:

http://turfdisease.osu.edu/turf-dise...-fertilization

John

John

Very Nice study, But it actually answers Larry's original question of what to use. It also answers when to Use it. It does not answer Smallaxe's question about Plants needing sun to Metabolize Fertilizer. AS hard as it is to believe someone would ask that question. Not being a cool season guy this is only interesting trivia to me. But it does show my post to Riggle about not using slow release was wrong, My bad. I will admit I find Ammonium Sulfate gives a better color and response to turf than urea. However I also find urea formaldehyde (Blue Chip) give a even deeper dark Blue Green than any other Nitrogen source. Of course you pay for it.
__________________
.

"TG doesn't give a rats ass about being "Responsible" as long as sales/production quotas are met. That's it in a nutshell. A recipe for disaster IMO." Ted Putnam 2/28/14

You can lead a Donkey to water but you can't make the Jackass Drink

"As Americans you have the right to be stupid." John Kerry

"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-31-2011, 06:31 PM
americanlawn's Avatar
americanlawn americanlawn is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: midwest
Posts: 5,517
the winner is phasthound

Thanks Barry, you are certainly correct. I posted this to see if folks were paying attention, but you saw right through it. Who applies aluminum? ("ammonium" sulfate would have been closer to the fact).

While ammonium sulfate may be beneficial during the early spring to give turf a "kick", it's kinda a waste of money during fall & late fall in the upper Midwest IMO.

Granular vs prilled: both can be spread. Prilled is a higher quality/more expensive product. I remember seeing granular urea for just $6.00 per 50 pound bag in the mid 80's.

I prefer some slow release N before winter, cuz even during heavy snow cover, the 4 inch soil temp often stays above 32 degrees. Rhizomes of Kentucky bluegrass can still be somewhat active during even the coldest of winters depending upon several factors (soil type, soil temps, sun exposure, etc, etc).

Iowa State University (not the University of Iowa) has done very extensive research regarding the use, formulation, rates, and timing of nitrogen application. We try to keep in tune regarding their studies. I also appreciate the input we receive from Agrium, Pro-AP, and a couple others. (all are lawnsite.com sponsors)


Quote:
Originally Posted by phasthound View Post
None of the above.
__________________
Proud subscriber of TURF Magazine. (thanks Ron)
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 08-31-2011, 06:33 PM
americanlawn's Avatar
americanlawn americanlawn is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: midwest
Posts: 5,517
Nice link. I agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by countryclublawnllc View Post
Smallaxe

Into the fall/winter season depending on location etc. the plant will still be photosynthesizing utilizing the suns energy. The energy that it converts from the sun and turns into usable sugars and storable carbohydrates will give it better winter hardiness, root growth, as well as enhancing spring greenup. A good study was done in the mid 80's out of Ohio State that showed the benefits of late fall feeding. As stated above the plant will take up energy either through the shoots or roots as fall progresses, up until close to frozen ground occurs. The later the fertilizing the more it would be preferred to use readily available nitrogen sources opposed. I have always had a good response from the ammonium sulfate products later in the fall or early in the spring but if soil temps are still decent urea would be a cheaper source and still very effective. Here's a link to an article that summarizes the study:

http://turfdisease.osu.edu/turf-dise...-fertilization

John
__________________
Proud subscriber of TURF Magazine. (thanks Ron)
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 08-31-2011, 06:37 PM
fl-landscapes's Avatar
fl-landscapes fl-landscapes is offline
LawnSite Silver Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: SW Florida
Posts: 2,296
Quote:
Originally Posted by americanlawn View Post
Thanks Barry, you are certainly correct. I posted this to see if folks were paying attention, but you saw right through it. Who applies aluminum? ("ammonium" sulfate would have been closer to the fact).

While ammonium sulfate may be beneficial during the early spring to give turf a "kick", it's kinda a waste of money during fall & late fall in the upper Midwest IMO.

Granular vs prilled: both can be spread. Prilled is a higher quality/more expensive product. I remember seeing granular urea for just $6.00 per 50 pound bag in the mid 80's.

Phew.....I thought someone hijacked your computer or you lost your marbles. Most of us used the thread to discuss fall fertilizing so it served a purpose beyond the gag anyhow.

I prefer some slow release N before winter, cuz even during heavy snow cover, the 4 inch soil temp often stays above 32 degrees. Rhizomes of Kentucky bluegrass can still be somewhat active during even the coldest of winters depending upon several factors (soil type, soil temps, sun exposure, etc, etc).

Iowa State University (not the University of Iowa) has done very extensive research regarding the use, formulation, rates, and timing of nitrogen application. We try to keep in tune regarding their studies. I also appreciate the input we receive from Agrium, Pro-AP, and a couple others. (all are lawnsite.com sponsors)
Posted via Mobile Device
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 08-31-2011, 06:39 PM
fl-landscapes's Avatar
fl-landscapes fl-landscapes is offline
LawnSite Silver Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: SW Florida
Posts: 2,296
Phew....thought your computer was hijacked or you lost your marbles........most of us discussed issues with fall fertilizing so it served a purpose beyond the gag it was meant to be anyhow.
Posted via Mobile Device
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 08-31-2011, 06:52 PM
Ric's Avatar
Ric Ric is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: S W Florida
Posts: 10,973
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ric View Post
Larry

I got a call today about the Bold Print above. The LCO was asking what was the differences. When I explained that the question wasn't even ask correctly, he Immediately knew the answer. Your Question should have read What is the Difference in Spreadable and soluble or spray-able Urea??

Granules are in fact Prill, or the same thing in the case of 46-0-0 Urea. The Granules or prill size of Spread-able Urea are larger so they weight more and can be thrown by a broad cast wheel of a Rotary spreader. Soluble or Spray-able Urea has much smaller Prill or Granule size almost powder like so it dissolves quicker. It is possible to Spray Spreadable Granules/prill But it takes longer to melt the Granules. It is possible to spread Spray-able Urea but look out for stripping because the Granules are not heavy enough to spread outward.

I explained that the question wasn't even ask correctly,

Larry this brings up an other point. When you first came to Lawnsite you were Mr Answer Man. True not always the correct answer but you pounded your chest and told everyone how big your business was and how you had Worked for the Duke Bros Etc so you were the 30 year Go To man.

Lately You have been asking questions any newbie on the Block should Know. So my question is are you trying act Dumb or Do you need to see a doctor about some kind of Memory Loss possibly cause by Pesticide poisoning like Dursban Twitch????


..


Larry

I am not so sure Slow Dog was the only one to spot the stupidity. The Grub thread sure didn't do a lot for your credibility. My question about your possible problems from Pesticide poisoning (Dursban Twitch, etc) was Real. It comes from following your post over several years.


..
__________________
.

"TG doesn't give a rats ass about being "Responsible" as long as sales/production quotas are met. That's it in a nutshell. A recipe for disaster IMO." Ted Putnam 2/28/14

You can lead a Donkey to water but you can't make the Jackass Drink

"As Americans you have the right to be stupid." John Kerry

"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 08-31-2011, 07:25 PM
americanlawn's Avatar
americanlawn americanlawn is offline
LawnSite Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: midwest
Posts: 5,517
Hey - you were the only one to suggest that "nutrients" provided grub control. I figured you were kidding -- then I realized you were trying to throw a fast ball like I did, except your "fastball"l was slower than mine.....gotcha ya.
__________________
Proud subscriber of TURF Magazine. (thanks Ron)
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1998 - 2012, LawnSite.com™ - Moose River Media
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:21 PM.

Page generated in 0.07383 seconds with 7 queries