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  #301  
Old 03-01-2013, 12:02 PM
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puppypaws puppypaws is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickhippy View Post
I'm on mobile so if I miss anything , my bad.
Green, ill email you the pics sometime over the weekend. Have little to no Internet at the moment.

The stuff Greens cutting is very quick growing. It's like a Bermuda on steroids. It can be cut as low a 1" if done more than once a week. But as soon and customer say fortnightly or even weekly, we just know its a pita to cut. What looks like scalping is just cutting at normal height.
I've seen photos of that grass growing up and into house windows. It's a pasture grass from Africa I believe.

Anyway, Green is also cutting a grass called sir Walter. It's a buffalo similar to st austustine. (Sp).

Puppy, you have to understand something. Buying a mower over here isn't like there. I wish they were only $10-12k, but there not. I paid over $17000 for my SZ. $500 just for a hydro service! Blades are $30+. Point is, when we spend that much, it's a very hard pill to swallow when it doesn't do as expected. We will loose way to much to much on a trade in.

Unless I'm working in absolute perfect conditions, I have the same dramas. Even in great conditions, hit one little spot with any moisture but still short, ill get a clump.
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This is as I've already mentioned, a totally different grass type, one which appears to be very fast growing, with more of the growth moving in a horizontal; instead of vertical direction.

My deck set in the # 4 position (as Green stated) is cutting at 2 1/4" (57.15 millimeters), meaning he is probably cutting in this same range.

Looking at the photo of the Dixon cutting the same property , but with probably less moisture, the only difference is the Dixon deck is processing the clippings into a smaller form. Like with an Exmark Ultra Cut deck that also processes the clippings into a shorter size; it gives a better look than will a tunnel deck that is designed to process more grass, but in a faster method. The longer clippings produced by a tunnel deck are much more difficult to hide, this is only common sense.

You can still see the mat of clippings in his photo, but because of the smaller size, the cut area looks better. The longer clippings, with moisture added into the equation can also promote the dropping of clumps, as seen in many photos of your area.

I have never seen anthing even close to resembling this, and I cut Bermuda, Kentucky Blue Grass, Fescue, and a mixture of Crabgrass and weeds, but do cut on a 5 to 6 day rotation when necessary. The more grass, especially moisture laden grass a tunnel deck needs to process, the more problems you will incur.

You can take a Scag Velocity Plus deck, cut the same areas you are having problems with, and you will see the same type mat of longer clippings, but not as long. The reason the Scag cut will look better to the human eye is for the fact it processes the grass clippings into a size between the VX4 deck, and the Exmark Ultra Cut, or Dixon shown in the picture. It takes very little size difference in clippings to make a finish cut look completely different.

What I can gather from everything that has been shown and talked about is, the VX4 tunnel design deck will never give that further processed grass clipping look; while cutting your faster growing, moisture laden type grasses, in what appears is normally a more damp, tropical type region.

I would like a question answered, what percentage of your cutting gives this type problem? If I had to guess, I would say the dryer periods give you much less problem, cutting in the mid to late afternoon gives less problem, and cutting on a less than weekly basis (not feasible, I understand) would give less problems. Would this be a correct assumption?

Would everyone agree you can still see a mat of grass clippings, but due to being smaller, they are much less noticeable?

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  #302  
Old 03-01-2013, 12:51 PM
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GMLC GMLC is offline
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I see clippings evenly dispersed with no clumps. In my experience decks that have smaller clippings clump worse, like Exmark. I have never seen clumping this bad from an open style deck like this VX4 in the other pics.
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  #303  
Old 03-01-2013, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by GMLC View Post
I see clippings evenly dispersed with no clumps. In my experience decks that have smaller clippings clump worse, like Exmark. I have never seen clumping this bad from an open style deck like this VX4 in the other pics.
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This is the exact reason we all have to agree to disagree.

In this part of the country the Ultra Cut deck gives the most finished looking cut on highly fertilized, irrigated lawns, but requires more scrapping due to its stronger suction. The Scag Velocity Plus gives a good cut in virtually all cutting scenarios, but will leave longer clippings on top than will the Exmark. The Hustler will cut more grass by far than either the Scag or Exmark, and does a great job in the dryer, southern, stiff blade grasses, but will disperse an even longer clipping.

This is what makes the world go around, different opinions on the same subject. This does not mean one opinion is any better than the other, it only means people can get different thoughts; on different things. They can then give the options they've heard a try, and see in reality which opinion did hold the most merit for their particular situation.
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  #304  
Old 03-01-2013, 01:36 PM
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I agree with your deck comparisons completely and its the same here. But clumping problems have always been on tightly baffled decks that produce small clippings. Small clippings clump together easier and also pack decks. The VX4 is an open deck with large clippings yet its clumping. The large clippings are collecting somewhere or somehow with this deck that go against other open style decks.
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  #305  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:14 PM
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greenology greenology is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by puppypaws View Post
This is as I've already mentioned, a totally different grass type, one which appears to be very fast growing, with more of the growth moving in a horizontal; instead of vertical direction.

My deck set in the # 4 position (as Green stated) is cutting at 2 1/4" (57.15 millimeters), meaning he is probably cutting in this same range.

Looking at the photo of the Dixon cutting the same property , but with probably less moisture, the only difference is the Dixon deck is processing the clippings into a smaller form. Like with an Exmark Ultra Cut deck that also processes the clippings into a shorter size; it gives a better look than will a tunnel deck that is designed to process more grass, but in a faster method. The longer clippings produced by a tunnel deck are much more difficult to hide, this is only common sense.

You can still see the mat of clippings in his photo, but because of the smaller size, the cut area looks better. The longer clippings, with moisture added into the equation can also promote the dropping of clumps, as seen in many photos of your area.

I have never seen anthing even close to resembling this, and I cut Bermuda, Kentucky Blue Grass, Fescue, and a mixture of Crabgrass and weeds, but do cut on a 5 to 6 day rotation when necessary. The more grass, especially moisture laden grass a tunnel deck needs to process, the more problems you will incur.

You can take a Scag Velocity Plus deck, cut the same areas you are having problems with, and you will see the same type mat of longer clippings, but not as long. The reason the Scag cut will look better to the human eye is for the fact it processes the grass clippings into a size between the VX4 deck, and the Exmark Ultra Cut, or Dixon shown in the picture. It takes very little size difference in clippings to make a finish cut look completely different.

What I can gather from everything that has been shown and talked about is, the VX4 tunnel design deck will never give that further processed grass clipping look; while cutting your faster growing, moisture laden type grasses, in what appears is normally a more damp, tropical type region.

I would like a question answered, what percentage of your cutting gives this type problem? If I had to guess, I would say the dryer periods give you much less problem, cutting in the mid to late afternoon gives less problem, and cutting on a less than weekly basis (not feasible, I understand) would give less problems. Would this be a correct assumption?

Would everyone agree you can still see a mat of grass clippings, but due to being smaller, they are much less noticeable?

This grass is predominate here in sydney, Im not sure if your suggesting that the grass is the problem? But I can tell you I have the clumping issue with all the grass types I cut, kikuya, buffalo & couch. Your wrong about the grass growing more horizontal than vertical, it most certainly grows vertical faster than the latter. Dont know where you came to that assumption.

The grass has the same moisture content in this photo with the dixon, you can actually see the tyre impressions due to the ground being so moisture laden. The issue of clumping im getting with the VX4 is not evident in this picture, the only way to get a better job than this would be to cut the grass more regular (this cut was fortnightly) however as you know some clients prefer more money in the bank than a perfectly manicured lawn.

I would be happy to settle for longer clippings providing they arent gathering into small clumps... the issue is not with the size of clippings, its the clumping of clippings. If the longer clippings were dispursed out evenly you would see larger sized clipping with no clumps, the only way to see clumps with long clippings, is if they are gathering into small piles. Why they are gathering & how they are gathering is all we need to know and problem will be solved, instead we are wasting time debating with you...

The best answer to your question I can give you is this type problem is occuring more than enough for me to eventually lose my good clients and have no chance of generating any future clients, clients who have "luxury 5 acre lots" who are after a relatively neat finish on there grass cutting. I do have a handfull of clients whome it will never matter to them, but they arnt the weekly/fortnightly good paying clients either. The problem is occuring in the afternoon after a 35 degree day whereby I could roll around in the grass and not get an ounce of moisture on me. In that situation I had to cut the grass 2 settings higher than normal, & in some places the clumps still occer, in dry but slightly longer/thicker grass. However as I have said, cutting higher is a problem in itself, eventually you have to go higher again as the weekly growth brings the grass back to the same amount to trim off, so this is when you would have to go up another setting. Then the grass becomes thatchy and spongy, you struggle to walk through it, its much higher than the paths, then when your clients complains & wants you to cut it lower... your left with huge clumps, yellow scalping everywhere, takes twice as long, need I go on?. How is there any solution... Other than fixing the issue, which is something to do with the discharge of the VX4 deck.

Your too conceited to realise that all your points are a wasted effort. All you appear to be doing is conflicting the issue & what for? you must be getting a kick out of it.
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  #306  
Old 03-01-2013, 04:22 PM
Ridin' Green Ridin' Green is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMLC View Post
I agree with your deck comparisons completely and its the same here. But clumping problems have always been on tightly baffled decks that produce small clippings. Small clippings clump together easier and also pack decks. The VX4 is an open deck with large clippings yet its clumping. The large clippings are collecting somewhere or somehow with this deck that go against other open style decks.
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I agree completely with this statement, and it is the problem that Green and Mick are experiencing, yet should'nt be.


Puppy
- you may be confusing a lot of readers following along with some of your terminology. Point of reference- calling the VX4 a tunnel deck. It is not. Though I know why you are calling it that (because of the wide open design underneath, especially at the front of the blades where the main bulk of the grass flows), it is the wrong term. A tunnel deck is what comes on almost all lawn or L&G tractors and CUT's and some models of Gravely ZTR's. It has the deep tunnel running along the front of the deck, whereas a commercial Z has a flat topped, full depth deck for the entire deck. The VX4 (and 7 Iron Pro, V+) is/are what is commonly called an "open" deck design.
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I can also tell by looking back to see how they're hanging and often reach back and feel them to see how firm they are.

Last edited by Ridin' Green; 03-01-2013 at 04:26 PM.
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  #307  
Old 03-01-2013, 05:18 PM
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I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think this VX4 clumping issue is present on 66" and 72" decks. (can anyone confirm this?)

Just like the XR-7, the 60" size gets beat up again. It's the most popular deck size and it again is plagued with QOC issues.
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  #308  
Old 03-01-2013, 05:32 PM
Ridin' Green Ridin' Green is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TLS View Post
I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think this VX4 clumping issue is present on 66" and 72" decks. (can anyone confirm this?)

Just like the XR-7, the 60" size gets beat up again. It's the most popular deck size and it again is plagued with QOC issues.
This is a good point, and I'd like to know more about this as well.
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Originally Posted by Darryl G
I can also tell by looking back to see how they're hanging and often reach back and feel them to see how firm they are.
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  #309  
Old 03-01-2013, 05:36 PM
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Because the 66" and 72" XR-7's cut absolutely fine. No stragglers, better dispersal, less loading up.
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2004 GMC 2500HD Reg Cab BOSS 9.2 V-Plow
2013 eXmark LazerZ X-Series 60" 34hp EFI (RED) Kohler
2006 Hustler SuperZ 28EFI 60" Power Chute Design OCDC SOLD!
Perma-green Magnum
1996 48" SCAG Belt WB 14hp Kawasaki Classic Deck
Echo 2 strokes PB-755 & SRM 280
Eastman WM20H 20" Commercial Push mower (NEW for 2013)
Commercial Lawnboy trim mower 2-FOR SALE!
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  #310  
Old 03-01-2013, 05:39 PM
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greenology greenology is offline
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Hey Ridin or TLS, sorry you have probably mentioned this before. Have either of you experianced the clumping, thats if you have the VX4?
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