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  #171  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:29 AM
AIRCORP AIRCORP is offline
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Imprelis Resolution Agreement

Hi Cindy

What I meant to say and perhaps was not clear, trees equal to or less than 20 feet in height are not being treated fairly in the DuPont resolution process. In Michigan, for example, I contacted about 5 or 6 reputable tree sale operations and received prices for trees 20ft and under. I calculated the cost of replanting and disposal of toxic materials etc. Then I compared those values to several Resolution agreements I was asked to review. In each case, I had to recommend that the property owner get local pricing, consider the extra removal and installation costs, repair to turf, landscape and hardscape features etc.

I know what Dupont is offering for trees less than 50 feet tall for some species. I don't know if DuPont is using this valuation scale for all species.

I do know, for a fact, that Imprelis is still active in the soil and still causing injury to trees including many hardwoods. And yes, your roses may be impacted. I have seen many damaged roses with odd shaped leaves and yellowing consistent with a damaged root system.

Do not discharge grass clippings on flower beds or around trees. Blow the clippings away from plants if possible. Remember, DuPont has warned up not to mulch with grass clippings, well, if you discharge the clippings onto flowers what do you think the results will be? And why is DuPont warning everyone to completely remove all plant material from trees and plants they are cutting down? And warning not to put in compost or mulch sites? Think about it? They know their chemical Imprelis is still active and cause injury.
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  #172  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:33 AM
AIRCORP AIRCORP is offline
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Cindy. Ask yourself a few questions:
1. Where was the Imprelis applied?
2. What plant organ was first to contact and remain in contact with the toxin?
3. If the roots were damaged, probably more than the canopy, will they be able to absorb nutrients or water as efficiently as non treated trees?
4. What is going to happen when the temperature rises and the trees need more water?
5. Why are we seeing so many "yellow or light green" tree and plant leaves on Imprelis treated property?

If the roots are injured, then they simply won't function normally. You are going to see nutrient deficiency problems, wilting, die back in the tree canopy etc.
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  #173  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:38 AM
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cindyb cindyb is offline
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We have figured out the first offer is lower than it should be.

I'd like to know the value of the larger trees also, mine are mostly 30 - 40 feet tall. I will be doing a counter offer, I've had more damage since the first report and dupont's site visit wouldn't include since it wasn't on the original report.

I'll get some pictures tonight of my deformed blackberry leaves and my yellowed roses. My knock out roses stopped blooming, just dead blooms.

No doubt that the Imprelis is still active, new growth on my trees are deformed and then dies.

Are you an arborist? Attorney? LCO? Wondering why you are checking resolutions?
Quote:
Originally Posted by AIRCORP View Post
Hi Cindy

What I meant to say and perhaps was not clear, trees equal to or less than 20 feet in height are not being treated fairly in the DuPont resolution process. In Michigan, for example, I contacted about 5 or 6 reputable tree sale operations and received prices for trees 20ft and under. I calculated the cost of replanting and disposal of toxic materials etc. Then I compared those values to several Resolution agreements I was asked to review. In each case, I had to recommend that the property owner get local pricing, consider the extra removal and installation costs, repair to turf, landscape and hardscape features etc.

I know what Dupont is offering for trees less than 50 feet tall for some species. I don't know if DuPont is using this valuation scale for all species.

I do know, for a fact, that Imprelis is still active in the soil and still causing injury to trees including many hardwoods. And yes, your roses may be impacted. I have seen many damaged roses with odd shaped leaves and yellowing consistent with a damaged root system.

Do not discharge grass clippings on flower beds or around trees. Blow the clippings away from plants if possible. Remember, DuPont has warned up not to mulch with grass clippings, well, if you discharge the clippings onto flowers what do you think the results will be? And why is DuPont warning everyone to completely remove all plant material from trees and plants they are cutting down? And warning not to put in compost or mulch sites? Think about it? They know their chemical Imprelis is still active and cause injury.
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  #174  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:42 AM
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cindyb cindyb is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AIRCORP View Post
Cindy. Ask yourself a few questions:
1. Where was the Imprelis applied?
2. What plant organ was first to contact and remain in contact with the toxin?
3. If the roots were damaged, probably more than the canopy, will they be able to absorb nutrients or water as efficiently as non treated trees?
4. What is going to happen when the temperature rises and the trees need more water?
5. Why are we seeing so many "yellow or light green" tree and plant leaves on Imprelis treated property?

If the roots are injured, then they simply won't function normally. You are going to see nutrient deficiency problems, wilting, die back in the tree canopy etc.
Almost every tree we own, is dying or deformed. I stuck some tomato plants out near my worst trees, will keep a picture diary.
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  #175  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:44 AM
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cindyb cindyb is offline
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This thread has 8100 views. Not just us keeping informed.

Heading to a meeting.
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  #176  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:46 AM
Starbuy Starbuy is offline
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[QUOTE=cindyb;4421189]Welcome to the conversation AC.
Trying to understand your statement that trees under 20 feet tall aren't covered for replacement? [QUOTE]

Dupont is offering to compensate for replacement is not enough to actually take care of replacement, which is what I also heard from Davey Tree. They also confirmed to me that the first lowball offers from Dupont are no where near what they need to be in order to do all the work that needs done on most properties in removing and replacing trees.

Everyone waiting on an offer from Dupont for Imprelis damage compensation really needs to get ALL the estimates from private contractors (not the LCO who used Imprelis) for everything from tree removal, high quality same size tree replacement (and really larger since many have lost growth they would have had by the time compensation might arrive), all landscape beds and lawn that gets ripped up needs repaired, electricians that need hired to re-lay any utility lines that must be removed and replaced to your house in the digging process, and any other circumstances for your property. And, for some you'll end up displaced from your home since you won't have electric, phone, cable, etc. during the time utilities are affected. I'm bringing in my home builder to help assess this as well.

Be careful not to undervalue what your true loss is, but if you just have trees and shrubs around that you don't care to replace then maybe you'll be satisfied with the initial low offer from Dupont. That's what they hope for in sending out these initially insulting settlement offers. But this is the way most things work in settlements. Negotiation is normal, but in the end many of us may have to just resort to the courts for help. Just like Apple and Samsung who are in meeting right now as part of a court ordered settlement talk to see if they can agree before they continue back to the courts, which they probably will unless Samsung agrees to not (allegedly) copy Apple's products. These things take time and unfortunately it's affecting our homelife, our quality of life, our time and our property values. Dupont must pay for all of this, in my opinion.
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  #177  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:50 AM
AIRCORP AIRCORP is offline
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Starbuy listed some very interesting information concerning the half life of Imprelis in a recent post. This information is taken from the following EPA document which can be downloaded from the web.

EPA-HQ-OPP-2009-0789-0014[1] Registration

Look on page 13 - 14 concerning "Environmental Fate". You may want to read other sections as well. There are about 2.54 cm per inch for conversion purposes.
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  #178  
Old 05-23-2012, 11:59 AM
AIRCORP AIRCORP is offline
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Location: New Franklin, MO
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Cindy
I just read that settlement agreement you posted. DuPont is lying about imprelis impacting ground water.

Here is what they were quoted as saying:

Aminocyclopyrachlor does not pose significant risks to human health or groundwater contamination, DuPont spokeswoman Kate Childress said.

"Contamination of well water by Imprelis is highly unlikely," Childress said.


This is what their EPA Regsistration document says on page 13:

1.3.2. Environmental Fate
Aminocyclopyrachlor is non-volatile, highly soluble in water, and highly mobile to mobile in
soils. Dissipation in the environment is expected to occur predominantly via aqueous photolysis, runoff, and leaching. Terrestrial field dissipation occurred with half-lives ranging from 22 to 126 days. Aminocyclopyrachlor was detected at soil depths of 70 – 90 cm at 365 days, indicating that leaching of residues into groundwater may occur.

I wonder if I should send a copy of this to DuPont? What don't they understand about being "highly mobile" in soils? That means it moves through soils, downward and laterally, very easily. That is why Starbuy had injury on his property because it moved off the target property onto his. I have seen and photographed many properties with injury far from the application site.
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  #179  
Old 05-23-2012, 12:43 PM
Tree Lover Tree Lover is offline
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Aircorp
This truly scares me about our water. We live on over a acre of land and yes we have well water. I have 2 children who drink water daily from our tap from taking to school water bottles everyday to the bottles they fill for their sports not to mention my husband coaching my sons team and all the water bottles he has filled over and over during the last year to provide for those 17 kids on the team!!!!! The water from my well.
I am terrified to think of the effect it could have on my family!!!!
Cindy could you please provide the email address you have when emailing Dupont.
Starbuy, do you have well water also? If so have you been using it over the past year.
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  #180  
Old 05-23-2012, 12:56 PM
Starbuy Starbuy is offline
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[QUOTE=Tree Lover;4421246]Aircorp
Starbuy, do you have well water also? If so have you been using it over the past year.[/QUOTE

No, I use city water. But, our property and many others in my neighborhood that were impacted by Imprelis are adjacent to the Cuyahoga River in Ohio. Oh boy, this is going to turn into an even bigger mess. The EPA spent millions over the last few years improving the quality of this stretch of the river and they will be looking into this I'm sure.

Dupont will say that the chemical in Imprelis only affects the growth hormones of plants and therefore safe for animals and humans. But, anything that damages the things we eat; how does the molecular structure get altered when damaged by this chemical? They'll be a documentary coming on this fiasco, I assure you.

I'm grateful for Aircorps input on this thread. Please keep it up.
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