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  #31  
Old 04-04-2012, 11:29 PM
S&MLL S&MLL is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Somerset County NJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Gretzmier View Post
I think it all boils down to what we, as installers add dollars wise to whatever prices folks can find out there, and does the potential client think our expertise is worth that additional cost. If they already have a bid in hand, and are checking online, then they already have their doubts.

If you bid a job and spec a certain name brand, or you mention that name brand when you do your sales presentation, such as, we ONLY use brand x, then you are marrying yourself to whatever they find online about that company.

If it is after the fact, you already have the fixtures in, and folks find online pricing for the brand name they find on the lights or trans,and they feel as though you overcharged them for the whole install, then really they are either unfair or you did not convince them that they got value for their money. why else would they be checking?

But even before cast put it up, like steve said, you could already find those prices online from Cast distributors by googling it. So I don't see what the issue is by Cast selling to folks that don't have a distributor and making money off it.

I would say that for Cast installers having the pricing out there at least lets folks know that they are expensive fixtures to buy without installation. It helps justify bids in my opinion.

Still doesnt answer the question of 20 percent off msrp..... why have a msrp. When the m isnt following their own suggested price
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  #32  
Old 04-05-2012, 12:31 AM
newz7151 newz7151 is offline
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Location: Tejas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steveparrott View Post
Over the years, I've fielded dozens of complaints from homeowners that have been served poorly (or not at all) by distributors-to-the-trade. One homeowner drove 30 miles to a distributor to buy lamps, only to be turned away at the door because homeowners were not welcome there. Another was furious after numerous attempts to purchase lamps locally, he said, "Obviously your system doesn't work!"
Here is a supply chain:

Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer/Installer, Customer.

Now:

Manufacturer, Customer. You've cut 2 "middle men" there.

Of course the homeowner that drove 30 miles to the distributor should be turned away. They are an end user and should purchase from a retailer/installer, not be able to purchase from a distributor.

Crap like that "Direct Buy" company is the start of all problems like this.. seriously, if you are going to cut your authorized distributors and retailers/installers, then you better be ready to significantly increase your customer support budget, because you've just gained a butt load of "customers" who are going to be buying your stuff online and calling YOU when it doesn't work. Don't try sending them to a local installer for help, they're probably already in the process of ditching your product as this thread progresses.

If a manufacturer wants more control over their distribution and pricing you do it by enforcing fines and legal penalties on the places that are not in the right. Places that may be using your trademarks without being an authorized distributor or retailer, places that are caught online selling below your MAP, serialize your product so you can track where it's being distributed from against your distribution policies and cut those distributors off at the knees in favor of the places that are actually holding up their ends of your "Authorized Dealer Agreements"

(this is just coming from a mower sales and repair place though, i have no idea how the lighting industry functions, so maybe the same practices do not apply)
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  #33  
Old 04-05-2012, 09:15 AM
steveparrott steveparrott is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Tampa, FL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newz7151 View Post
Here is a supply chain:

Manufacturer, Distributor, Retailer/Installer, Customer.

Now:

Manufacturer, Customer. You've cut 2 "middle men" there.
You might have missed the beginning of the thread, we're not cutting out anyone. All online orders go to our distributors for fulfillment. And, in every possible place we encourage consumers to hire a professional.

And to the question in the other threads - "How is it MSRP if the mfg. charges MSRP minus 20%?" Again, these are not our orders. It would be different if we sold direct to the consumer.
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  #34  
Old 04-06-2012, 07:10 PM
David Gretzmier David Gretzmier is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Fayetteville,AR
Posts: 3,654
at one time ( 2001-2004 ) I was defined as a distributor of Brite Ideas products. I paid 20k plus for that right, and the understanding was that I had exclusive rights to sell the product in my area. I even had a contract saying so with sales quotas, etc. . Brite Ideas began selling products online in 2002, and in the beginning they sent me checks when they sold product to any of the zip codes that were in my territory. I received the difference between what the customer paid and what my cost from them would have been.

It was a pretty sweet deal at first, and then the checks stopped. I continued to see product sold and installed in my area, maybe by homeowners, and I no longer had "exclusive" rights to the Brite Ideas line.

I purchased another "distributorship" from Holiday Bright Lights ( now holidynamics) and my relationship with Brite Ideas was severed for other reasons as well. It is my hope for Cast installers that distributors of the product do better in this arrangement and not worse.

It seems in this case Cast is trying to maintain the best possible relationship with its distributors while trying to sell product to folks that do not have a distributor.

I for one am happy Cast is out there with it's pricing, as they are a very expensive line and it sets an internet pro priceline referance for many of us.

Any potential customer of mine who buys cast online is pretty serious about spending money on landscape lighting.
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