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  #91  
Old 10-17-2012, 06:22 PM
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Tharrell Tharrell is offline
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You know, it would be cool if the blades operated off hydraulics and the wings were independent of the main deck in such a way that the mower could be used in tighter spaces if need be.
Although, I suspect this mower is designed to give a wide cutting stance and still be trailerable.
I don't know, wouldn't 2 72" be a better value and cut more, faster?
Somebody, somewhere has the beans counted to make it work I'm sure.
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  #92  
Old 10-17-2012, 09:21 PM
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puppypaws puppypaws is offline
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Originally Posted by Tharrell View Post
You know, it would be cool if the blades operated off hydraulics and the wings were independent of the main deck in such a way that the mower could be used in tighter spaces if need be.
Although, I suspect this mower is designed to give a wide cutting stance and still be trailerable.
I don't know, wouldn't 2 72" be a better value and cut more, faster?
Somebody, somewhere has the beans counted to make it work I'm sure.
The two 72's with their faster speed could realistically be 40% more productive at about 2/3 the price. This 104 is for certain applications of which I'm afraid many will not find a need. If you got into perfectly smooth turf where the 72's could utilize all their speed, they could easily be over twice as productive, but this is what 15 mph versus 11 mph can do for productivity.
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  #93  
Old 10-17-2012, 09:28 PM
StanWilhite StanWilhite is offline
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Originally Posted by puppypaws View Post
The two 72's with their faster speed could realistically be 40% more productive at about 2/3 the price. This 104 is for certain applications of which I'm afraid many will not find a need. If you got into perfectly smooth turf where the 72's could utilize all their speed, they could easily be over twice as productive, but this is what 15 mph versus 11 mph can do for productivity.
I feel the same way you do Puppy, it may be a little too "specialized" for a very large majority of landscapers/mowers.

The one significant thing that would offset it's higher cost, would be the labor cost to run the extra Z (when comparing 2 Z's to this mower).
(I didn't read the whole thread so this may have already been brought up.)
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  #94  
Old 10-17-2012, 11:04 PM
Realslowww Realslowww is offline
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I will probably see one at the state University a mile up the road. It would work perfect there and they use some Hustlers.

The new ATZ that is in production will use the same drive I was lead to believe.
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  #95  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:25 PM
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puppypaws puppypaws is offline
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Originally Posted by StanWilhite View Post
I feel the same way you do Puppy, it may be a little too "specialized" for a very large majority of landscapers/mowers.

The one significant thing that would offset it's higher cost, would be the labor cost to run the extra Z (when comparing 2 Z's to this mower).
(I didn't read the whole thread so this may have already been brought up.)

I was at my dealer's today and noticed 4 Super Z's sitting outside their shop entrance, and they looked like they had been rode hard and put up wet on more than one occasion. I ask my friend which is their head mechanic where the mowers had come from, he said one of our customer's just bought four new Super Z's, and those are the ones he traded. He then went on to say, this customer trades all his mowers just before the warranty runs out, and says his business operates much better that way, the customer says when the warranty runs out they can dollar you to death.
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  #96  
Old 10-19-2012, 12:22 AM
RoyalTree RoyalTree is offline
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I was just quoted 60k for a toro 5900, thats a 16 ft cut. Why not get a toro 4500 or 5900 if you need that extra size or stay with a 72. 30k will be hard to justify.
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  #97  
Old 10-19-2012, 05:20 AM
Realslowww Realslowww is offline
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Originally Posted by puppypaws View Post
I was at my dealer's today and noticed 4 Super Z's sitting outside their shop entrance, and they looked like they had been rode hard and put up wet on more than one occasion. I ask my friend which is their head mechanic where the mowers had come from, he said one of our customer's just bought four new Super Z's, and those are the ones he traded. He then went on to say, this customer trades all his mowers just before the warranty runs out, and says his business operates much better that way, the customer says when the warranty runs out they can dollar you to death.
I would have thought the same thing but a savy person can keep them going cheap, if you mow a ton of grass and really use the warranty to it's fullest extent then getting new machines when the warranty runs out makes the most sence.

Like I saw where you did a post back a while ago where you were talking about the difference between a ATZ wheel motor and the Super. I found the ATZ wheel motors for 170 new and with prices like that unless you are running a ton of hours up every year it may be more cost effective to fix what you have.

I can update both of my Supers with 44 Generacs and ATZ wheel motors for around 5 grand and have more powerful mowers than practically almost anything out there. That is more cost effective for me than buying a new Super Z.
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  #98  
Old 10-20-2012, 06:11 PM
johnnybravo8802 johnnybravo8802 is offline
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Originally Posted by Ridin' Green View Post
If you need varification of what I said, just go to Land Pride's Or Wood's websites and read what they have to say about their side discharge vs rear discharge mowers. The rear discharge decks require higher HP.
That's actually not correct. A rear discharge requires less HP. This is true because a rear discharge only cuts the blade of grass once and then spits it out the back which means it doesn't have far to travel and this requires less HP. With a side discharge, the furthest blade cuts the blade of grass, then sends it to the next two blades and then it's cut twice more which means the clippings have to travel the full width of the deck before their discharged. It requires more HP to do all of this-the laws of physics will tell you this is so.
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  #99  
Old 10-20-2012, 06:30 PM
johnnybravo8802 johnnybravo8802 is offline
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Do you guys realize this thing has an MSRP of $30,000!!!!You could buy 3 Super Z's for the price of one of these machines. That means that one flex wing for this mower costs as much as an entire Super Z!!!!!!!!!!That's completely ridiculous. I assume this machine is meant to replace the range wing which had an 11' swath. However, what you have to remember is that the range wing was an industrial machine and had two engine options-38 HP Kubota diesel or a Ford 54 HP engine. In essence, this machine won't really compare if you're looking at apples to apples and will probably be underpowered.

What you also have to look at is practicality and productivity. I tried out a Lastec 100' with a 38 HP kubota and wasn't impressed. This thing was so slow and cumbersome, it was a joke and was only practical out in large open spaces. You can forget about maneuvering around trees with a mower this size-it just won't do it!! Also, when the Lastec was pointed a little down hill, it just slipped and slid because the weight of 100' of deck was always dragging it down hill. My 60" Scag was literally running circles around this machine and the rep got mad about it and accused me of turning up the mower, which I didn't. The Lastec was also a rear discharge and left a really crappy cut in contrast to my velocity deck.

I think they said the ground speed on this mower was 10-11 MPH. Trust me, 3 Super Z's(Cost of mower) at 15-16 MPH will far out cut this mower. Great concept and nice looking mower but not practical from a productivity and economical standpoint.
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  #100  
Old 10-20-2012, 08:15 PM
Ridin' Green Ridin' Green is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnybravo8802 View Post
That's actually not correct. A rear discharge requires less HP. This is true because a rear discharge only cuts the blade of grass once and then spits it out the back which means it doesn't have far to travel and this requires less HP. With a side discharge, the furthest blade cuts the blade of grass, then sends it to the next two blades and then it's cut twice more which means the clippings have to travel the full width of the deck before their discharged. It requires more HP to do all of this-the laws of physics will tell you this is so.
I understand exactly how they work bro. You can argue with the manu's if you want, but they say more HP is required, and the link I posted shows that to be true. It's also my experience. The rear discharge decks cut the clippings more than once as well, because the clippings get cut at the front then sent back over and round the blades all the way to the rear before going on out the exit at the back of the deck. Each blade gets wrapped up in/by the clippings from front to back, not just at the front like a side discharge deck does, and that drains HP. Run both sometime on the same exact machine on the same day, on the same turf. You'll get to experience it for yourself firsthand. The difference isn't drastic, but it is there.
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