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  #11  
Old 10-28-2012, 10:51 PM
Mikegyver Mikegyver is offline
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Originally Posted by zacher View Post
I was going to get a lawyer....then he tried to charge me $1000 to set up an LLC ...in the state of Georgia fees are only $100 I knew this going in; he tried to sell me on how he would do this and this. I left never called him back. Set up my LLC and here I am. The only thing I would recommend is a CPA; if you cant afford one maybe try an agreement to maintain their property for their services.
The LLC that an individual can set up is not the same caliber that a lawyer puts together. Its worth the extra dough. I paid more for mine than your lawyer quoted for yours and he gave me a discount.
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Originally Posted by acculawnsystems View Post
I agree. Good legal advice is very important. They can help you avoid many problems in the future. Once you get your LLC established. You should ask the lawyer to draw up as contract for services. This will allow for you to established your terms with you customers so that you lock in contracts and both you and your customers know the parameters. We have a terms of agreement section on our website that allows for the customer to get instant online quotes and if the price is agreeable the customer then agrees to our terms before we perform the work. This happens with not much effort on all part and the customer knows exactly what the agreement is from the beginning. Go to acculawnsystems.com for more information.
You really don't need a lawyer to draw up a contract....just find a few good ones and fuse them into your own.
Mike
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  #12  
Old 10-29-2012, 07:33 PM
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Woody82986 Woody82986 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikegyver View Post
The LLC that an individual can set up is not the same caliber that a lawyer puts together. Its worth the extra dough. I paid more for mine than your lawyer quoted for yours and he gave me a discount.

You really don't need a lawyer to draw up a contract....just find a few good ones and fuse them into your own.
Mike
Regardless of whether or not you hire a lawyer or even a CPA, make certain you understand what is going on with what you want to do. If you do the research and understand what you are doing then there is absolutely no difference between a person or a lawyer filing the paperwork for an LLC or a Corp. Lawyers don't have special powers. They simply did the research and know what they are doing. You don't have to pass the bar exam and become a licensed attorney to file necessary paperwork. It just takes knowing what paperwork to file and where to file it.
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  #13  
Old 10-29-2012, 10:11 PM
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GreenI.A. GreenI.A. is offline
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Originally Posted by Woody82986 View Post
Regardless of whether or not you hire a lawyer or even a CPA, make certain you understand what is going on with what you want to do. If you do the research and understand what you are doing then there is absolutely no difference between a person or a lawyer filing the paperwork for an LLC or a Corp. Lawyers don't have special powers. They simply did the research and know what they are doing. You don't have to pass the bar exam and become a licensed attorney to file necessary paperwork. It just takes knowing what paperwork to file and where to file it.
This depends greatly on the state. Some states require an attorney to file the articles of incorporation to form an llc, s-corp, c-corp, & etc. If that is the case, you can usually go the cheap route, such as legal zoom, you fill the paperwork out online and pay the fees and they will have an instate attorney file for you. I looked into this and found that the process was completely different if you hired your own attorney directly. I found that here in MA many companies who used legal zoom, and later found themselves being sued did not have the proper protection that an llc or corp should provide to the owners.

Also, as far as contracts go. What we have found to be the best route is we write our own first, then our attorney goes over it and makes revisions to be sure it is proper. This allows us to save a great deal of money as compared to having the attorney write the whole contract.
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  #14  
Old 10-29-2012, 11:02 PM
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zacher zacher is offline
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Originally Posted by Mikegyver View Post
The LLC that an individual can set up is not the same caliber that a lawyer puts together. Its worth the extra dough. I paid more for mine than your lawyer quoted for yours and he gave me a discount.

You really don't need a lawyer to draw up a contract....just find a few good ones and fuse them into your own.
Mike



......sooo you pay a ton of money to form an LLC because it is not the same "caliber" as one a lawyer can put together. Well I dont know how it is in other states but in Georgia there is no smoke and mirrors magic. It is very straight forward and an easy process. There are plenty of helpful guides readily available.

I just think its funny how awe I am gonna pay a lawyer a bunch of money...but my legally binding contract I can just "throw a few good ones together and make my own" .... that is how customers and their lawyers find loopholes if for any reason something ever goes wrong...

Dont take this advice...put in the legwork and review how to form an LLC properly and correctly in your state save a few dollars and THEN go to the lawyer and have him draft up a contract for you or however your business chooses to hire the lawyer...definitely don't just throw something together..
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  #15  
Old 10-29-2012, 11:39 PM
Mikegyver Mikegyver is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woody82986 View Post
Regardless of whether or not you hire a lawyer or even a CPA, make certain you understand what is going on with what you want to do. If you do the research and understand what you are doing then there is absolutely no difference between a person or a lawyer filing the paperwork for an LLC or a Corp. Lawyers don't have special powers. They simply did the research and know what they are doing. You don't have to pass the bar exam and become a licensed attorney to file necessary paperwork. It just takes knowing what paperwork to file and where to file it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zacher View Post
......sooo you pay a ton of money to form an LLC because it is not the same "caliber" as one a lawyer can put together. Well I dont know how it is in other states but in Georgia there is no smoke and mirrors magic. It is very straight forward and an easy process. There are plenty of helpful guides readily available.

I just think its funny how awe I am gonna pay a lawyer a bunch of money...but my legally binding contract I can just "throw a few good ones together and make my own" .... that is how customers and their lawyers find loopholes if for any reason something ever goes wrong...

Dont take this advice...put in the legwork and review how to form an LLC properly and correctly in your state save a few dollars and THEN go to the lawyer and have him draft up a contract for you or however your business chooses to hire the lawyer...definitely don't just throw something together..
On the LLC, basically my lawyer made my LLC a lot more bulletproof then if I had gone through legal zoom or filed the paperwork myself. I.e. setting up the membership structure,Unanimous Written Consent, company agreement, etc. You don't get that paperwork from just sending in the form to the state. Like i said (at least in texas) that the LLC a lawyer puts together is a lot better than one that you do yourself.
on the contract, many people just find several good ones and fuse them together. I had a friend generously offer me the one that he uses and I edited it to fit what I needed to do. It fills the purpose just fine.
Im not saying that the way I've done it is the right way but its worked for me and ultimately thats the bottom line, do what works for you.
Mike
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  #16  
Old 10-30-2012, 01:03 PM
CL&T CL&T is offline
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I found that here in MA many companies who used legal zoom, and later found themselves being sued did not have the proper protection that an llc or corp should provide to the owners.
Well, I think that came from your lawyer. As long as the LLC is set up you are provided the intended protection- for what it's worth. An LLC is treated differently by different states and I believe some states don't recognize an LLC at all. The IRS does not recognize an LLC. Come tax time you are a sole proprietor or partnership, whatever the case. So if you want some kind of protection look to either an S corp or a full C corp. But keep in mind that even with those the corporate veil will not protect you if gross negligence is alleged or protect you from creditors since suppliers are smart enough to get personal guarantees unless you have been in business a long time and the business credit is good. So as far as I'm concerned, if you are thinking of forming an LLC you would be just as "protected" by operating as a sole propreitorship and save your money.
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  #17  
Old 10-30-2012, 02:40 PM
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GreenI.A. GreenI.A. is offline
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Originally Posted by CL&T View Post
Well, I think that came from your lawyer. As long as the LLC is set up you are provided the intended protection- for what it's worth. An LLC is treated differently by different states and I believe some states don't recognize an LLC at all. The IRS does not recognize an LLC. Come tax time you are a sole proprietor or partnership, whatever the case. So if you want some kind of protection look to either an S corp or a full C corp. But keep in mind that even with those the corporate veil will not protect you if gross negligence is alleged or protect you from creditors since suppliers are smart enough to get personal guarantees unless you have been in business a long time and the business credit is good. So as far as I'm concerned, if you are thinking of forming an LLC you would be just as "protected" by operating as a sole propreitorship and save your money.
That did not come from my attorney who filled the LLC. It came from a close family member who does corporate law, they recomended the corporate attorney over legal zoom when I was asking them if it was worth the extra money. When going through LegalZoom they go the chepest route, the minimum paperwork is filled, and the instate attorney who is suposed to review the paperwork and file it, is the attorney who is willing to do it the cheapest. Where as if you hire your own attorney, their are additional optional forms that they can file along with your articles of incorporation. But like I said in my post, every state is different.

I do agree with you on the limits of protection a LLC offers. I have numerous posts on here warning guys of the samething. An LLC basically offers no additional protection if you are a sole operator. The only real protection it does provide is in the event of a lawsuit brought on by the neglect of an employee. Then the owners personal property may be protected, so long as it can not be shown that the owner was in any way negligent. I think most sole oporators form LLC's for one of two reasons. They either, wrongfully believe it offers protection, or they do it simply to look more lagitimate than a DBA.
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  #18  
Old 10-30-2012, 03:05 PM
CL&T CL&T is offline
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They do it simply to look more legitimate than a DBA... or they don't know any better. So unless you know something about the various business entities such as what they provide and their tax implications in YOUR specific situation I would advise consulting with an accountant and attorney.
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  #19  
Old 10-30-2012, 03:59 PM
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lawnkingforever lawnkingforever is offline
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[QUOTE=CL&T;456So as far as I'm concerned, if you are thinking of forming an LLC you would be just as "protected" by operating as a sole propreitorship and save your money.[/QUOTE]
Not a more true statement. There is no real advantage in being a sole prop. vs. LLC if your solo.
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  #20  
Old 10-30-2012, 05:41 PM
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clydebusa clydebusa is offline
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Originally Posted by grandview (2006) View Post
Funny.lawn guys are the cheapest people around yet we want to be paid the big dollars!
I have thought this a million times reading some of the stuff on here. !
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