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  #231  
Old 06-04-2013, 02:03 PM
dboyd351 dboyd351 is online now
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Cape Charles, VA
Posts: 765
PJM,
I'm guessing the hard re-start problem might be either 1) a coil starting to go bad, or 2) some sort of vapor lock.
However, I'm nowhere near as good a mechanic as a bunch of other guys on this site, so I think starting a new thread on those problems would be beneficial.
Good luck on ironing out those last few problems.Probably has nothing to do with the rebuild.
You done GOOD
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  #232  
Old 06-06-2013, 12:14 AM
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Johnagain Johnagain is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Altoona, Florida
Posts: 356
Make sure you have the right spark plugs installed. I bought a used cub a few years ago that had the wrong temp plugs that gave me the same problems. Put correct plugs in and it started and runs fine all the time now.
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  #233  
Old 06-06-2013, 12:49 AM
herler herler is online now
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,729
I am sure I'm not the first to say it, but say it I will, anyway.

I know about being stubborn and having that desire to do something just because I think I can...

I know about this morning I went to try and mount a car tire (four of them, to be exact).
Yes, I have tire mounting tools, not the nice fancy pneumatic ones, but the manual kind...
Still it wasn't my first.
And things weren't going so well, minutes before I ruined a tire I went up the road to ask how much...
Get a load of this, $60 all four tires mounted and balanced.

The guy got the one tire I thought might be ruined (and he too wasn't so sure) mounted and holding air.
That saved me a headache and about $80, the rest were still new so no problem.
Not an hour and $60 later, I was back on the road.

You have to know, some days, whether the sweat and effort is truly worth the money saved.
As things stand it would have been hours before I had them tires mounted, and it wouldn't be the first time I've ruined a tire's inner bead out of sheer force of will trying to get it on the rim, you really have to know sometimes...
When to call, when to raise, and when to fold.

I could have seen using that charred frame, cleaning it up and re-coating it, then using it to make some type of a gasoline-powered offroad vehicle...
Just for the fun of it.

As for the mower, I am pretty sure it would have been cheaper to just buy a new one.

Last edited by herler; 06-06-2013 at 12:58 AM.
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  #234  
Old 06-06-2013, 06:45 AM
dboyd351 dboyd351 is online now
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Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Cape Charles, VA
Posts: 765
Quote:
Originally Posted by herler View Post
I am sure I'm not the first to say it, but say it I will, anyway.

I know about being stubborn and having that desire to do something just because I think I can...

I know about this morning I went to try and mount a car tire (four of them, to be exact).
Yes, I have tire mounting tools, not the nice fancy pneumatic ones, but the manual kind...
Still it wasn't my first.
And things weren't going so well, minutes before I ruined a tire I went up the road to ask how much...
Get a load of this, $60 all four tires mounted and balanced.

The guy got the one tire I thought might be ruined (and he too wasn't so sure) mounted and holding air.
That saved me a headache and about $80, the rest were still new so no problem.
Not an hour and $60 later, I was back on the road.

You have to know, some days, whether the sweat and effort is truly worth the money saved.
As things stand it would have been hours before I had them tires mounted, and it wouldn't be the first time I've ruined a tire's inner bead out of sheer force of will trying to get it on the rim, you really have to know sometimes...
When to call, when to raise, and when to fold.

I could have seen using that charred frame, cleaning it up and re-coating it, then using it to make some type of a gasoline-powered offroad vehicle...
Just for the fun of it.

As for the mower, I am pretty sure it would have been cheaper to just buy a new one.
You really DON'T get it, do you Topsites?
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  #235  
Old 06-06-2013, 08:03 AM
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clydebusa clydebusa is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Tulsa Oklahoma
Posts: 1,550
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjm123a View Post
OK, here is where I am. The mower is basically all together including the deck. It is fully functional and cuts grass!!! See last pic. Yes dboyd, I am a happy camper. My wife wanted to take some pictures of me sitting on it but I am now quite there yet. In my original post (12/2/2012) I said: "I want my scag back as close as possible to the way it was before". Before I consider myself done, I have to fix 2 known issues and then do some more testing. Issue 1 is that it creeps in neutral. I know about the adjustment rods but I could not get them to turn. I have had to completely diss-assemble them from the pumps. The ends are seized preventing the rod from turning so it is not possible to adjust them. I have broken the ends loose on one of them and an putting anti-seize compound on them before putting them back. I attribute this to a problem that existing in the donor mower. Issue 2 is that the engine is really hard to start when warm. It starts immediately when cold. Even if it has run for just a minute and you shut it off it is hard to restart. It just cranks and cranks and cranks and eventually fires. The carb and choke and all linkages seem to be OK. Some research that I've done says this condition might mean the valves need adjustment. Since I don't have any history on the donor engine, I don't really know. I think this bears further checking however. I originally had a third issue as well. The engine would throttle up OK and run at full power until you actually started to cut grass. When it was loaded it would not rev up as you might expect. I thought this would end up being a problem with the governor. However, I noticed that when I blipped the throttle the plastic hose connecting the airbox/air filter assembly to the carb would collapse. I took the air filter elements (dual elements) out and re-fit everything (I think the inner element may have come loose). Now it seems to run normally under load. I will do some more testing to ensure that it is really fixed.

So, that is where I am for now. I am not quite done yet, but I'm sure in the end game!! Thanks for all the advise, encouragement, and even the reality checks along the way.
I noticed one thing missing from the picture,,,,


FIRE EXTINGUISHER!!
Nice JOB congradulations.
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  #236  
Old 06-06-2013, 09:01 AM
pjm123a pjm123a is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: FL
Posts: 112
The hot-start problem ended up being caused by the engine running too hot. It got that way because it was running too fast at wide open throttle (over revving). While mowing with the engine under load it was not as noticeable as when I ran it as part of my testing specifically to get it to the no-start condition. After adjusting the governor and ensuring that all the carb linkage could run it's full length, the engine now runs slightly slower at wide open throttle. In turn, it does not get quite as hot after it has been running for a while and now reliably re-starts even when hot. In the end, I no longer automatically think that this was always a problem with the donor engine. When I moved the Kawi engine from the donor chassis to the burned chassis I obviously had to disconnect and re-connect everything. I was very careful about the cables but did not pay much attention to the mounting bracket. Part of the fix was moving the bracket a bit lower. See pic.

For anyone who thinks it would be cheaper to buy a new one, let me tell you that you are wrong (at least in pure dollars sense). Grossed up I have a little under $2000 total and that includes every thing (even the sand for sandblasting). However, I have sold some parts (even from the burned engine). I am net now around $1600. If I can sell everything that I want, the total cost will be about $1200 - $1400. This does not even count the value of parts that I now have and intend to keep. A new engine alone for this mower is over $2000 at the dealer. An entire new mower is over $8,000 at the dealer.

Now there are those who will tell me that I should count my time. I viewed my time spent on this as leisure time. I do not have a landscaping business. I work on motorcycles (my own) and decided to try my hand at a zero turn mower. I learned a lot, enjoyed it and would do it again. Sure there was some frustration but without that you cannot experience the joy of figuring something out and making it work!

Also, I know my limits. In deference to herler, I have mounted motorcycle tires, trailer tires, and lawn mower tires with hand tools (tire spoons). No way though that I would try that with a car tire. Anyone who followed this thread knows that I brought another SCAG mower because I knew that this was going to be a labor of love that would take a long time. I was prepared to work on this for years buying parts piecemeal on ebay if that is what it took. Only reason it took months instead of years was because I lucked out and found the wrecked mower that had almost all the parts I needed. Going into this, I was prepared to walk away and harvest all the parts I could and sell them and scrap the rest if it did not work out.

Anyway, enough ranting. I did what I did, am happy I did it, and would do it again!
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  #237  
Old 06-06-2013, 07:25 PM
Bashby Bashby is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Charles Town WV
Posts: 344
I agree with calling it liesure time, great project! Did you happen to keep track of how many hours you had into it?
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  #238  
Old 06-07-2013, 06:43 AM
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Mickhippy Mickhippy is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Queensland, Australia.
Posts: 3,733
You needn't explain anything mate! Enjoy the machine and keep us up to date with how it goes. Love to see some more pics of it out in the field cutting grass!
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  #239  
Old 06-07-2013, 07:21 AM
ztman ztman is online now
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: mountain pa
Posts: 626
I think what you did is great. Nice to accomplish something in leisure time.
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  #240  
Old 07-02-2013, 09:53 PM
pjm123a pjm123a is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: FL
Posts: 112
I'm finally considering the restore project complete. Someday I will do something about the seat but it now runs, cuts, and looks pretty good if I do say so myself. I've placed it back into service as my backup mower and have cut several acres with it under varying conditions. It feels just look it's old self. Here are a few pictures showing some late adder little touches like the brake lever grip and the stopper cable that holds the seat. It is quite complete. The obvious addition is the fire extinguisher. It is mounted to a quick disconnect bracket which in turn is mounted to the ROPS with hose clamps. Pull one pin and the extinguisher is ready. Final picture shows a before and after. Thanks again to all for the virtual help, encouragement, and words of wisdom. It is now July 2nd 2013. I've been at this since Thanksgiving 2012 but I can finally say: THE SCAG IS SAVED!!!
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