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  #11  
Old 03-12-2013, 06:09 PM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunton Guy View Post
I've had some soil tests come back with low cation exchange capacity levels. Is their a formula to find just how much organic materials need to be added to get the levels up?

What works the most effectively at getting the CEC level raised? We are dealing with red clay soils.
SOM going up will definately improve your CEC but in that type of Soil Texture you'll want to improve Soil Structure in order to make it count for something... OM sitting on top of a block of clay, doesn't do much for you...

I would research Soil Structure away from this forum, but that is the biggest issue with clay soils, especially for those who never let it dry out enough, but got to keep it wet all summer long...
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
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  #12  
Old 03-17-2013, 09:42 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is online now
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CEC simply means the resting spot for nutrient ions that are accessible to the roots and are typically 'colloids' of clay, silt and humus...

By definition your red clay SHOULD have lots of CE Sites according to definition, but this article will help to make sense as to why it doesn't... If you'd like to discuss it feel free to PM...

http://soils.missouri.edu/tutorial/page9.asp

"... Aggregation begins with flocculation of clay particles (platelets) into microscopic clumps called floccules; the cations that are caught between two platelets attract the negative charges on both platelets, binding them together..."
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
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  #13  
Old 03-17-2013, 09:48 AM
Kiril Kiril is offline
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No, by "definition" it does not.
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  #14  
Old 03-17-2013, 10:36 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is online now
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I was pointing out that the primary colloids in which CE Sites typically are 1). Clay, 2) Silt, and 3) Humus...

These are the Big 3, by Definition of "What colloids generally function as CE Sites???"

And the answer is: ...
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
*
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  #15  
Old 03-17-2013, 10:40 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is online now
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I may have to ignore the rest of this thread if clay colloids do not make CE Sites under the correct circumstances... My point to be made is Creating The CORRECT Circumstances for the clay to be useful as increasing CEC... so if I stop responding it is becuz once again the conversation will not be allowed to go in that direction... sorry...
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Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
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  #16  
Old 03-17-2013, 10:52 AM
AllBrad AllBrad is offline
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subscribed......
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  #17  
Old 03-17-2013, 11:41 AM
Kiril Kiril is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
I may have to ignore the rest of this thread if clay colloids do not make CE Sites under the correct circumstances... My point to be made is Creating The CORRECT Circumstances for the clay to be useful as increasing CEC... so if I stop responding it is becuz once again the conversation will not be allowed to go in that direction... sorry...

Clays (layer silicates) primarily have a permanent charge, with exception to kaolinite, and secondarily pH dependent. How are you going to "create the correct circumstances" that will have any impact on this permanent charge? Further colloids, by definition, are classified as having a diameter of 0.1 to 0.001 μm (microns) .... silt is 0.002 to 0.05 mm by definition.

Now the soil minerals we are concerned about with respect to CEC are layer silicates (clays), amorphous silicates, oxides and hydrous oxides and organic materials. As I have already stated, the only way you can reasonably change a given soils CEC (short of complete removal and replacement) is by increasing the SOM.

Do you realize the amount of damage you cause by incorrectly speculating on public forums?
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