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  #11  
Old 09-21-2013, 05:46 PM
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BlazersandWildcats2009 BlazersandWildcats2009 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
Looks like it is dried out... organic can't replace water... Does water even soak in on that slope???
Looks like some serious drainage issues. I'm far from a landscaper, but I would clear everything out all the way to dirt. Spray a herbicide, wait a month, or build a wall edging in the mean time. Haul in several tons of soil and level off the whole lawn, use the wall as a barricade. Lay sod over the top of the level soil. Possibly install irrigation before. (Something I didn't do, and I can tell you from experience it's a mess keeping sod moist for a month straight by regular sprinklers, but can be done.) Hopefully I can give some useful advice from the valuable information people have gave to me around here and take a little time off of their hands because I know Agrostics and a few of you others are BUSY outside.
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  #12  
Old 09-21-2013, 07:57 PM
recycledsole recycledsole is offline
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Well thanks for the replies. I have been working on the trees there. I added organic compost and overseeded in the spring.
Now I will be adding a little more compost and overseeding a fine fescue instead of tall fescue, adding sprinklers, adding burlap fabric "erosion blanket" and taking more limbs off the tree.
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  #13  
Old 09-21-2013, 10:27 PM
recycledsole recycledsole is offline
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Are there any organic herbicides also?
thanks!
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  #14  
Old 09-21-2013, 11:00 PM
Barnabas Barnabas is offline
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Why are you so set on "organic"??
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  #15  
Old 09-21-2013, 11:34 PM
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BlazersandWildcats2009 BlazersandWildcats2009 is offline
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Hopefully you got a hold of some quality compost that is a good start. Did you rake the compost into the soil or were you composting over existing grass? How much If you followed all my post we started to go the Fescue seed route in the shaded area. Kept deliberating from the cheap stuff to the more commercial type Fescue seeding which can be upwards of $100. a bag. Then got talked out of that and went with sodding. The sod cost around $100. a pallet for the cheapest out of all the callings I made to about $185.-$200. for quality from the farm. Each pallet covers about 450 sq. feet. As far as organic herbicide you could check into Corn Gluten Meal if you want to stick with the all organic route. http://eartheasy.com/article_corn_gluten.htm. Don't get it confused with regular Corn Meal which is used as a fertilizer and also has been shown to have fungicide preventing properties. How much are you plan on watering after laying the new seed? If your not wanting to go all out, I would level it out with top soil and compost the best you can, take care of low spots, and etc. is it a good time to seed in your area? That's good your taking out as many limbs that are shading the lawn as possible. Possibly mow much higher also in the shaded areas? I haven't looked into Fescue in months so I'm a bit rusty. But see how much water is required when seeding per day or week. If your getting steady rain, keep track of that, gauges are cheap. There are many organic products out there. Many such as Cornmeal are even rising in prices because their getting introduced my so many people as "organic" products and the feed stores catch on. However, in Texas we still have regular Corn Meal at $15.00 a bag, which has a formula of 21-0-0 (21% nitrogen.) The thing you have to be careful at, many people have "Organic" products that claim to do this and that, however, you have to realize their sales people also. Compost Tea seems to become more popular and popular. Composting during the grasses growing season also seems to be very effective. I'm planning to start 2-3 times a year now during spring and summer when my grass is actively growing. But research after research has proven it to be effective. There are also many other products out there such as fish emulsion, Liquid Seaweed, Molasses is also used. Do your homework on organic products or visit a site such as;http://www.garden-ville.com/index.php. But don't let the sales man sale to you. Research your local ag center and look up information there you will find very useful information. There could be a reason your grass looks the way it does. Perhaps someone didn't take care of it before? Maybe the soil conditions are bad and the neighbors with the pretty lawn have corrected theirs. The sun was also probably a factor. Just do your homework before wasting a bunch of time and money trying to go different routes. Figure out what works best for you.
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  #16  
Old 09-22-2013, 12:03 AM
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BlazersandWildcats2009 BlazersandWildcats2009 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnabas View Post
Why are you so set on "organic"??


If your worried about just throwing organic materials down, avoiding getting your soils ph level corrected, not following a water schedule, then your not going to receive any kind of results worthwhile for your time. If you insist on going the all organic route, I would assume you went to mowing all the lawns with a "push reel" mower rather than a gas mower while polluting the air? Composting is about the best proven thing as far as results are concerned and being organic. Many organic things out there show positive traits and benefits towards our lawns and even gardens. Fish emulsions, Compost, Corn Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Ammonia Sulfate, Espom Salts, Compost Teas, Soil Amendments, Green Sand, Peat Moss, Phosphate products, even sugar, beer, and soda has been used on golf courses. But if your just throwing them down, not taking account for your N- levels, your Phosphorus Levels, Potassium, how are you plan on growing? I know there are many other micro nutrients to account for that need to be in the soil, but just like many told me your going to need to get the correct basic growing "needs" for a lawn and your soil.

While organic can be a good thing, I think it can be a big waist of time if you don't educate yourself over the sales people. I would assume most customers of home care owners mostly care about having a healthy, lush, green lawn, rather than having the least chemicals in the ground. But if you go that route, you should be switching out the weed-wackers, edgers, mowers, and blowers.
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  #17  
Old 09-22-2013, 08:55 AM
recycledsole recycledsole is offline
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Organic is important for many reasons like health of soil, organism and human beings.
In my state 71% of people are exposed to 1 pesticide in particular in their drinking water. It causes breast cancer. I went to court to testify to get it banned. On the "house environmental matters committee" was an admitted pesticide dealer. So among health of planet and inhabitants, another reason is the lifestyle and (lack of) ethics associated with these industries. Google "world according to Monsanto". All for what? Aestetcially homogenous mono crop of grass; so many are poisoned. No thanks. If you look at other cultures who live side by side in nature they are much healthier and happier.
"A nation that destroys its soils destroys itself." - Franklin D. Roosevelt

Im going to apply .25" compost, fine fescue and modest amount of starter fert. after that I am going to lay down erosion control blanket. if this doesn't work im going to recommend landscaping instead of lawn.
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  #18  
Old 09-22-2013, 10:22 AM
NattyLawn NattyLawn is offline
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In the pictures it looks like this property is running some sort of business from a sign to the left of the walkway. What kind of traffic does this business have? The reason I ask is the areas that are beat up could be a result of high traffic and lack of rain this past month as well. I'm north of you, but we has a wet summer, but only received .3" of rain in August. Also, the beat up areas seem to follow the drip line of the tree. When it gets hot and the tree needs water, the tree will win out over turf. I think overseeding in fine fescue might be a mistake if there is high traffic on this home/business. Do you also mow the lawn?
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  #19  
Old 09-22-2013, 11:28 AM
Smallaxe Smallaxe is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlazersandWildcats2009 View Post
Looks like some serious drainage issues. I'm far from a landscaper, but I would clear everything out all the way to dirt. Spray a herbicide, wait a month, or build a wall edging in the mean time. ...
On a slope you want every clump of grass you have... The ability to stop the water from running away and soak into the ground instead,,, is what grass is designed to do... mulch mowing is important to keep the dirt covered and possibly enable quicker infiltration...

I can't speak for you part of the country right now,,, but too much watering may quite easily cause hydrophobic surface... it is called Fall over seeding because the weather is cool and once you soak up a spot,,, you don't want to pound it with more irrigation...

The compost will also need a correct moisture/air ratio in order for the compost to actually grow the fungi that builds the soil structure, that opens the soil surface...
__________________
*
Now that I know that clay's texture(platelets) has nothing to do with water infiltration, percolation, or drainage
,,, I wonder what does...
*
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  #20  
Old 09-22-2013, 12:45 PM
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BlazersandWildcats2009 BlazersandWildcats2009 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smallaxe View Post
On a slope you want every clump of grass you have... The ability to stop the water from running away and soak into the ground instead,,, is what grass is designed to do... mulch mowing is important to keep the dirt covered and possibly enable quicker infiltration...

I can't speak for you part of the country right now,,, but too much watering may quite easily cause hydrophobic surface... it is called Fall over seeding because the weather is cool and once you soak up a spot,,, you don't want to pound it with more irrigation...

The compost will also need a correct moisture/air ratio in order for the compost to actually grow the fungi that builds the soil structure, that opens the soil surface...
It's good you chimed in. So many people are making new post with these question threads, but are leaving out countless amounts of details. Forgetting people on the forum are from various parts of the country. We can speak of what we know, but now your mentioning rain. Where I'm from were lucky to get rain once every few months in the summer. That's if were lucky. Some very valuable information you posted for the original requester.

Don't take my post as an insult, I have nothing against organic products. Its best for the environment, people, and our society in general. From research I've seen lawns that were the healthiest looking lawns from "Organic Programs", but one thing I would bank my money on is that it took years to get that lawn that way. Not just years of organic products, but years of care.


If you want to stick to organics, your on the right track I suppose. Just do a simple search, you can locate everything you need; compost, corn meal, corn gluten meal, molasses, milk, Espom Salts, Fish Emulsions, Compost Tea, Actinovate, Vinegar, Reused grass clippings, the list goes on. If you go this route, I would advice you not to be asking for the "perfect lawn" over night.

And if I was worried about contributing to cancer than I would by far be just as concerned about the emissions from taking a car to work, pushing a lawn mower, along with the ciggs getting smoked outside on every block.

I would rather see chemical fertilizers getting put down for a good use, to improve the looks of a community, than see someone burning a cig on their porch that's contributing nothing to society, but also doing the same thing that chemical fertilizers do.

If you notice on the Cancer Fact Sheet; http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs297/en/

While our chemicals no doubt, contaminate environmental drinking water to a certain degree, there are many other factors that contribute to cancer beyond fertilizers being used on lawns. The main reasons being improper diets and pollution and chemicals put off my the thousands of cars on the road, along with the thousands of cig's getting put into the air each hour.

It just gets me how the government or a city could want to put a ban on using a fertilizer that improves the appearance of the community, but they don't mention anything about the main causes of cancer? Why? Because they make big $$ when it comes to oil and big money when it comes to tobacco.
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