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  #181  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:01 PM
Cornell Cornell is offline
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Originally Posted by AEL View Post
I stand by what i said long ago, long reach with mud matts and you have to bail the material multiple times. There is no way like you said taking multiple pieces of plywood and running over them with ctls is going to work. Ctl have tons of vibration and after a few passes the vibration will bring all the moisture and slop to the surface, not to mention one or two trips over the plywood and it will break. I have a job very similar to yours that is going to get started in the next few weeks. I am using the pc228 with mud mats and bailing the material twice to the ex that is loading. I have done it before. Put a good operator on a machine (under 24 tonne)with lots of mud matts and you will get it done.
I'm with you.

I've ran into soupy material like this before and CTLs will get BURIED fast. I don't care if you have the biggest and baddest Cat 299D in the world, once the undercarriage is suctioned in you can't bucket your way out, esp if there isn't a bottom for 5-6 feet. I'd rather be in a reduced tail swing like the PC228 or the companies new 235LCR excavator, way more options to get unstuck that way with mud mats.

I'd take a look in dirtmans thread for ideas, he's been in bad stuff like this before
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  #182  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:14 PM
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ksss ksss is online now
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Originally Posted by jmacd View Post
I don't post much on this site but this whole thread has many valuable lessons to learn from it.

First, the web site is not a good idea. The first customer that hires you, like a GC that finds out that those photo's are not yours will loose all respect for you and not hire you. Worse yet is that they talk with other GC's, your reputation will be hurt. Your web site is a misrepresentation of what you are capable of, a lie. The idea is to build trust with potential customers not start out the relationship with a lie. Be honest with your customers and your self.

As far as the project at hand, you priced it, you agreed to do it. Find a way with out going out of business. This is the first step in building trust with this customer and building your reputation.

When it is all said and done all you have is your word and your reputation.

I think you are looking for the easy way to build your company, there is none.
I personally agree with this. Whether anyone else (customers) cares who the pictures in a website actually belong to, I don't know for sure. Every photo on my website is mine. I have one photo that has a picture of a 721D in it, that machine was rented, other than that, the machines and jobs are mine. I personally could not fill a website with work I did not do. Customers are looking at your website and "assuming" its your work they are looking at. After all they went to your website to learn more about YOUR company. It just seems dishonest to build a site with clip art. However those are my feelings, and like I said, whether or not anyone else gives a shitt I have no idea.


I think anyone that has been in this line of work for any period of time has had jobs that you just miss bid for whatever reason. My biggest personal issue is, I get busy and kick a number out without putting as much thought into the details as I should. As the saying goes, "the devil is in the details". This project apparently was known to be a problem child. I don't know what your going to do to solve it, however going forward, I would suggest hiring a quality estimator if you don't have the experience to put numbers on jobs like this.
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  #183  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Cornell View Post
I'm with you.

I've ran into soupy material like this before and CTLs will get BURIED fast. I don't care if you have the biggest and baddest Cat 299D in the world, once the undercarriage is suctioned in you can't bucket your way out, esp if there isn't a bottom for 5-6 feet. I'd rather be in a reduced tail swing like the PC228 or the companies new 235LCR excavator, way more options to get unstuck that way with mud mats.

I'd take a look in dirtmans thread for ideas, he's been in bad stuff like this before
I think the issue with the reduced tail swing machines is the increase in weight. They may give you advantages in some ways, but the extra weight of the machine would be a disadvantage.

As to CTL, I think this is best done with an ASV. Lightest weight machine, wide and long tracks, and the suspended undercarriage would keep vibration to a minimum and possibly keep the ground from pumping.

I think ultimately you will have to spend some time and money experimenting with several different options on site. Until you actually put machines on site and start moving material, its impossible for anyone to know for sure what will work. I would put a plan into motion and continue to refine your plan based on what the ground will allow you to do.
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  #184  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:33 PM
PremierSwrx PremierSwrx is offline
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Thank-you everyone for your input, I'm going to try and answer as many questions as I can:
Project Value $50K, Total down 14k
There's a lot of provisions in our contract for unforeseen issues, things even as we don't operate when temps are less than 35 degrees. Problem thought is half this community signed never read the contract and when we throw contract terms at them they get all upset.

I would like to see if we cant review the contract and double or triple the price. But not sure if that will happen, I'm 100% for trying to complete the project and look good at the end.

Now I think AEL mentioned 30' mats, I like the idea now if I put 30' mats down do you think I can run a 320 and rock truck out there? I know plenty of guys with single axles dumps if we needed to go that route.

We are only removing about 2-3' of soil depending on the spot deepest is 3'
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  #185  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:39 PM
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Guys it's been proven many many times before by lots and lots of contractors and i have witnessed it multiple times on my own jobs , mud mats are the way to go. We have muskeg in northern Canada that has no bottom whatsoever ( way worse then sediment in a pond) and using swamp mats or mud mats machines as large as 345 cats walk over this stuff.
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  #186  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:40 PM
PremierSwrx PremierSwrx is offline
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Originally Posted by AEL View Post
Guys it's been proven many many times before by lots and lots of contractors and i have witnessed it multiple times on my own jobs , mud mats are the way to go. We have muskeg in northern Canada that has no bottom whatsoever ( way worse then sediment in a pond) and using swamp mats or mud mats machines as large as 345 cats walk over this stuff.
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I have a handful of mud mats like 6 that are older than me! what's the best way to build them/ where to buy them?
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  #187  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:41 PM
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Don't even try brining rock trucks out there. Bail the material multiple times . Start at the farthest point away from the shore and work your way back until you can load a rock truck while it is sitting on solid ground .
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  #188  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:43 PM
PremierSwrx PremierSwrx is offline
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Originally Posted by AEL View Post
Don't even try brining rock trucks out there. Bail the material multiple times . Start at the farthest point away from the shore and work your way back until you can load a rock truck while it is sitting on solid ground .
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We are going to be bailing a long way! Maybe Two Excavators feeding each other? As you mentioned before?
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  #189  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:44 PM
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AEL AEL is online now
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http://www.swampmats.ca/

http://www.paradoxaccess.com/
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  #190  
Old 02-05-2014, 02:45 PM
jmacd jmacd is offline
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Originally Posted by whiffyspark View Post
If you guys seriously think a GC cares about stock photos your mistaken.

As long as you say hey there stocks photos nothing more. Who the hell cares
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I know for a fact that the GC's I deal with have other options then us. They can hire any number of sub contractors and the price can be negotiated.

What GC's care about has nothing to do with the photo's, it has to do with the reasons they are there. It is about integrity.

Were on the web site does it say they are stock photo's?

If the OP put that much effort in a web site that was not even his work than what is going to be the next lie after he signs a contract. The only GC's he will get a chance at are the one's that have no other options.

Why would a you hire a company that misrepresents who they are when you can hire many that don't.
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