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  #31  
Old 06-08-2014, 05:00 PM
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INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting INTEGRA Bespoke Lighting is online now
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Originally Posted by GreenLight View Post
The integrated fixture companies offering 10-20 year warranties must seriously lose a lot of sleep hoping that these products don't begin to fail en masse in certain conditions or just in general. That's my biggest fear with integration and these companies who offer these extensively long warranties. Will they survive long enough to see that warranty if they take a huge blow
They are sleeping just fine, don't worry about them. Heck some of them have no worries about honoring any long term warranties... how can you worry about something you have no intention of doing?

Furthermore, there is probably a hedge bet that the very companies that are installing this stuff will not outlast the products they are putting in the ground. A warranty is great, as long as there is someone there to manage and administer it for you.

Did you know that you can actually buy warranty insurance? For a moderate monthly expense, you can protect your operations against the cost of warranty claims. Not sure who uses it, but it does in fact exist.
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  #32  
Old 06-08-2014, 05:15 PM
Avalon3 Avalon3 is online now
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Greenlight....first...it's nice to see guys like you make deeper mention of these elements and contributing solid thought.

You are right about the whole LED thing too....integrated units being a risk with these longer term warranties. I've notice many of the mediocre lines, whether big name or not, are offering these 15 and 20 year warranties. One of the big problems here (this is another topic) is that these warranties are have so many loop-holes as a means for these manufacturers to not warrant them. If you read into the fine print or the extended details of these warranties, you will see this.

For example, one of these major companies has duped many lighting guys into thinking they have a 15 year warranty. Then you read into the fine print and it says, "aluminum products have a 5 year warranty." The majority of their products are aluminum? So, if there are failures, which I'm sure there will be....they can back out after 5 years most likely. These LED's are housed in a lower grade aluminum with cheaper construction used. There's little hope for long term success in these units with that type of package.

A final note on this....these companies are likely charging the contractor/consumer at least double or more in order to effectively cover any replacement. I'm sure they are all planning on failures....so, they will protect themselves with building a cash fund for replacements (whoever gets them) and they will prey upon those that don't follow all the warranty rules, or those time constraints that originally were over-looked.

Anyways....it's nice to see some additional insightful information here.
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  #33  
Old 06-08-2014, 10:01 PM
RLI Electric RLI Electric is online now
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James, very nice way to summarize it all. Mark, you are correct with in the fact that some of these warranties are so ridiculous as to the point they should just not have them at all. It is unfair to the end user that they should have to bear with the fact that their lighting is compromised while a faulty fixture is sent back to the supplier, then off to the factory where they will determine if they repair or replace the unit. Meanwhile the end user is left with a dark hole in their lighting. This is unacceptable and why one of the major manufacturers will never see my business. Especially the fact that they cannot seem to keep their glass lenses from cracking and having the fixture fill up with water. I hate getting the call for repairs to their fixtures as my hands are tied and I have no leverage with a supplier because I don't use this particular line of fixtures.
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  #34  
Old 06-08-2014, 10:25 PM
Avalon3 Avalon3 is online now
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Bob...the sad thing is that many of these guys don't want the products back....I know one company in particular (with the 15 year supposed warranty) that allows the distributor the ability to make the call on returns. Then, they have them just pitch them in the trash!! That's a good environmental policy?
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  #35  
Old 06-09-2014, 12:30 AM
S&MLL S&MLL is offline
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Field destroy warranty is pretty big in the manufacturing business in general mark. Do you think sears sends the factory back all the broken sockets and ratchets. Just to play devils advocate the company does honor 15 year warranty on the led and driver itself. 5 years on the finish but at the end of the day even companies like bk lighting sell aluminum powder coated fixtures.

As for the aolp is that group still around? I haven't seen Paul post in years
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  #36  
Old 06-09-2014, 01:00 AM
Avalon3 Avalon3 is online now
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We'll see Matt? And, check out those warranty disclaimers closer....there are several distinctions in them to shuttle you around in circles or to not cover things, if they want not to. I did a long blog article on this a little while back that isolated examples of this.
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  #37  
Old 06-09-2014, 01:16 AM
S&MLL S&MLL is offline
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Distributer relationships is the key to this lighting world.

Which is why I'll never know why people buy fixtures of the interwebs
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  #38  
Old 06-09-2014, 10:49 AM
whiffyspark whiffyspark is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avalon3 View Post
Bob...the sad thing is that many of these guys don't want the products back....I know one company in particular (with the 15 year supposed warranty) that allows the distributor the ability to make the call on returns. Then, they have them just pitch them in the trash!! That's a good environmental policy?
It's cheaper to pitch them then take them back
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  #39  
Old 06-09-2014, 11:43 AM
Avalon3 Avalon3 is online now
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It may be cheaper to pitch them into the trash, but what does that really say about their quality to begin with?
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  #40  
Old 06-09-2014, 12:15 PM
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See, another reason that LED lamps are superior to integrated fuxtures... the end of life costs of disposal and recycling are significantly more with integrated fuxtures.



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