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  #11  
Old 08-24-2004, 04:04 PM
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Victor Victor is offline
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Bob

There are a lot of variables that I'd have to know, before I could recommend a specific filter for you. The fact that you want to blend the two styles of ponds together makes it even harder for me to help you.

How many koi you'll eventually have in your pond, how much flow you're going to want out of your pumps, how much room you'll have for your filtration system, if you're going to install this filtration system above ground, or below ground, is this pond going to be under a tree (or trees), how much sunlight will this pond get (on average) per day, how many gallons of water will the pond system contain, will this pond definitely be a koi pond, a water garden, or a blend of the two?

See what I mean Bob? If you want me to be able to really help you, give me the answers to those questions. If you can do that, I'll tell you the exact filter that I'd use if I were designing your pond. I'll even tell you what pump, or pumps I'd use. Keep in mind Bob, that as long as you use components that are designed to work with each other, you'll be well on your way to having a darn good pond on your hands. My idea of a good pond is one that maintains high water quality while requiring minimum maintenance to accomplish this.

As of right now, you're undecided on too many factors for me to be of much help to you. The fact that you seem to want to blend two styles of pond building together won't make it easy for me to help you. I noticed that you want to use a surface skimmer, or skimmers on your pond, but still would like to have plants on the surface of your pond (like lilly pads, or breaking the suface (like lotus). When debris lands on the surface of your pond, you do realise that those same plants that look so beautiful, will also keep that debris from being pulled into your skimmer, or skimmers before the debris waterlogs and sinks? Here's another example for you of the problems you might face if you blend designs without being super careful. You plan to have a skimmer, or skimmers. Floating plants (like hyacynths) will clog your skimmer inlets if you dont create a barrier to restrain them. If you create this barrier, you do realise that it will also stop floating debris from being sucked into your skimmer, or skimmers?

I'm not saying that it's impossible to have a good pond if you blend two styles together. I'm just telling you that if that's what you end up doing, you're going to have to be even more careful to avoid pitfalls when you start selecting components and designing it.

There are a lot of books out there on the market about designing ponds that aren't worth what the paper they're written on Bob. Some of the best information you'll find is on internet pond forums. Most of these forums are polar. They either have koi fanatics who can tell you everything you'll need to know on how to design a good koi pond, or watergarden fanatics. You're going to get totally different advice from these two groups on how to build ponds, but at least you'll be able be able see how a lot of them like to do things.

Vic
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  #12  
Old 08-24-2004, 05:36 PM
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BoB335 BoB335 is offline
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Hey Vic,

Thanks for the time you put in to answer my post. I am going to visit the pond that I posted above over the next couple of days. I'm guessing that you didn't have time to look at the many pics that she has. The water looks absolutely gorgeous. In some pics the koi had knocked some pebbles out of a plant pot on the bottom of the pond. The pebbles on the bottom from that are 3 1/2' down and you can see every detail. This woman seems to have no problem keeping her pond clean with koi and plants (she has koi and plants) She is also using a very cheap filtration system with some extremely efficient pumps. She claims this is very low maintenance and this pond is 7 years old. I'll let you knoe exactly what she has when I see it and I'm sure to be set on a design after that.
Thanks!
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  #13  
Old 08-24-2004, 09:02 PM
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Victor Victor is offline
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You're welcome Bob

I did take a look at her pond and it's beautiful. All I'm saying is that I'd have reservations about designing a pond like that.

The pebbles that you think the koi knocked out didn't come out in the manner that I'll bet you expected. Koi that are kept in a pond that has plants will often grab a hold of a plant's stalk with their mouths and uproot the plant. Some koi are only interested in eating plants, some koi are uprooters, some like to do both and some koi don't bother the plants at all. I'm not sure what kind she has (I'd have to imagine that hers for the most part leave her plants alone).

You mentioned how clear her water is. Unfortunately Bob, you can't tell how healthy pond water is by it's clarity. Some of the foulest, most polluted water is crystal clear. Some of the healthiest, pollutant free water is impossible to see through at all. Without testing the water yourself for nitrite and ammonia levels, you'll never know how good of a job her filters are doing. Keep in mind also that just because she has some koi in her pond and might keep her water quality high, doesn't mean that your water with the same home made filter system will keep your water clean if you go koi crazy and overload your pond with fish like most people do.

Vic
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  #14  
Old 08-24-2004, 10:53 PM
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BoB335 BoB335 is offline
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Hey Vic,
Here is this woman responding to someone on another forum. Her pond is 2300 gallons and she tests her water regularly.

We have 11 large koi that range from 20 to 26 inches long. 3 golden orfs that are about 20" long and several goldfish, along with several one and two year old koi.
When our koi were pups just a few inches long, we only had one filter tub (Thats all we needed--now we have three) No vortex tub (didn't need it) and we only cleaned our filters every two weeks if needed. As the koi grew in size, we daisey chained 2 more filter tubs on, added a vortex basket inside, and added a biological pond. Recently Cliff got rid of the vortex tub and just uses the entire first tub like a settlement chamber.

I'm not sure if I can overload my pond more than that. Anyway I'm hoping to see it tomorrow.
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  #15  
Old 08-25-2004, 07:59 AM
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Victor Victor is offline
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She has three filter tubs and a biological pond on top of that for filtration. That adds up to a lot of filtration. That first tub she mentioned is acting as her vortex (settlement) chamber. It sounds to me like she did a good job on properly filtering her pond. If you have the room and like the idea, a biological pond will do a great job keeping those nitrites and ammonia under control. It's just another way of doing what I did with my vortex filter and skippy filter. I took the high tech route and she took the low tech route. They both can fail, or work well. You just have to make sure that which ever road you take, you do it properly. Enjoy your trip Bob.

Vic
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