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Bad Starter? Toro kohler 22 hp

Discussion in 'Mechanic and Repair' started by privatelawn, Oct 11, 2007.

  1. privatelawn

    privatelawn LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 301

    Anytime I try to start the z it makes a weird noise attempting to start, grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr for a few seconds, anywere from a few seconds to about 15 seconds then the starter sounds normal and it turns on. It does this on every stop but will continue to start all day just with the same symptoms.

    What ive done to find out the problem
    #1 Removed starter from engine and cranked it, starter removed sounds normal using the mower battery.

    #2 Plugged it up to the trucks battery, also sounds normal.
  2. Restrorob

    Restrorob LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 11,023

    Sounds like it needs a tear-down and clean/lube, I have heard them make noise under load (engaged with flywheel) but not on the bench with no load.
  3. tomo

    tomo LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 660

    hello ,a strip down and clean in all the right spots is a good idea .

    If i can understand your description ,a little difficult over the net it does sound a little lke the one way bearing in the ""bendix"" is starting to fail .The bendix has a one way clutch bearing . Best description is the str turns over eg spins with a little noise and then a clunk starts to turn engine .In this case the bendix engages but the one way bearing is not working so there is no drive . Eventually it catches and the str works .

    The other situation may be the bendix is actually just clashing with the ring gear teeth mounted to the fly wheel .The teeth on the fly wheel can be redressed [filed ]if they r only slighly worn .

    There r many parts in the nippon str that wear that all lead to problems like this . Worn out solenoid contacts . Worn spline on the armature . Worn out throw out fork . Wear on the armature shaft . Worn out bushes Worn out bendix clutch bearing .

    The above issues would also apply to the delco str mtr but i have not experienced issues with them yet.

    The main electrical is an earth cable from the str to batt is recommended
    Battery supply voltage is good to the main cable and the solenoid wire ,at least 9.5 --10 volts while cranking

  4. privatelawn

    privatelawn LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 301

    Thanks guys.... It wont start anymore, starter still sounds fine, I slightly touched the flywheel while cranking it but the flywheel didnt move at all. The flywheel does move easyily when I tried turning it with a screwdriver with the starter off.

    On the bench the starter seems as good as new, that round thing with the teeth comes up and turns, I need to get it running in a hurry, do you guys think a new starter is whats needed? hoping its not the flywheel or engine after I buy a starter.
  5. Restrorob

    Restrorob LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 11,023

    Take your thumb and put it on this gear "thing with teeth" and see if you can turn it easily, It should free spin in one direction but spin the whole starter armature the other direction. You could also pull the flywheel cover and watch what this gear and the armature does when you hit the key.

    If the gear spins freely both directions the clutch inside is bad and just this piece can be replaced.

    If you do decide to buy a new starter instead of repairing this one check at your local NAPA auto parts store, They are around 100 bux cheaper than Kohler.
  6. privatelawn

    privatelawn LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 301

    That gear on the starter does spin freely both ways, where can I find this clutch thats needed? NAPA? or should I go to my local toro dealer? if the clutch does cost say 50% or more of what a starter would cost maybe I should replace the entire starter and save the hedache. When I go to napa do I tell them its for the kohler engine and stuff or take them the old one so they can match it to something they have?

  7. MHM

    MHM LawnSite Member
    Posts: 29

    any time you are looking for parts take all the numers you can find and the part. It sure helps I have been on both side of the counter.
  8. Restrorob

    Restrorob LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 11,023

    Ditto ^^^^^^^^
  9. mcambrose

    mcambrose LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 511

    Nippo starter on Kohler. I had several old NIPPO starters that acted similarly. I have a friend who is a really good machinist and also very persistent. We first thought it was solenoid problems. We tried several solenoids and they worked on bench and not in mower. We thought it was maybe a ground problem, but that didn't prove to be the problem. He finally noticed that the bushings in the bendix seemed to give too much slop and thus let the shaft bind. He made new bushings on the lathe at work and installed them. I has worked great. New starters aren't all that expensive on Ebay, but I just couldn't stand to throw the starters away when they looked like they should work. We checked with NIPPOn denso and they don't sell the brass bushings as separte parts.

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