Belgard Old World vs. Techo Villagio

Discussion in 'Hardscaping' started by Guinness56, Aug 13, 2010.

  1. Guinness56

    Guinness56 LawnSite Member
    Posts: 18

    Anyone out there install Old World collection from Belgard? It's a real sharp looking product. I'm comparing it to Techo's Villagio line...trying to get a nice cobblestone-like look. I found that the surface of the Old World was VERY undulated; to the point where I fear someone might actually twist an ankle...low odds, but possible (I think). I also can't get a clear understanding of their warranty. Techo seems cut-and-dry from that perspective and Belgard's seems to be lifetime only if installed by a dealer. It's also made here in NJ by Anchor and I can't tell if their warranty is the same. The Old World looks a little nicer from a color perspective too.

    I actually worry that shoveling snow on the Belgard ones could potentially damage them with a metal edged shovel (most snow shovels have that on the leading edge) as the varying lips will certainly get caught...then they'll slowing look like @!$#% over time.

    I also looked at Unilock's Courtstone which also looks real nice...but, it was over $3 more a sq ft than the Techo! ($7.40 vs. $4.08)

    Thanks in advance for any feedback.

    Joe
     
  2. BrandonV

    BrandonV LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,197

    belgard will warranty them if installed by an authorized contractor. ive never used the old world, looks like a good product though. i can just about guarantee you that your snow shovel won't hurt them, a snow plow may... those are two things I'm not at all familiar with.
     
  3. Guinness56

    Guinness56 LawnSite Member
    Posts: 18

    Thanks...yeh, I guess you don't need shovels and the like down by you. Those Belgard ones do look pretty unique. Just wish they weren't so rough.

    So, they only warranty if installed by certified installer? It's ironic, to that point, I had a slight argument with the local dealer that sells them as they were telling me that I should just use mason sand or stone dust for the bedding layer yet everything I read on ICPI says absolutely not....that it's too fine....and that it must be concrete sand or ASTM C33 compliant. He also said I should never have to worry about using geotextile fabric. I think, at a minimum, I should put a small section right where my walkway will intersect by paved driveway to prevent washout, rutting, etc right there.

    Joe
     
  4. Guinness56

    Guinness56 LawnSite Member
    Posts: 18

    I was just going through the tech spec again. looks like the Belgard, if installed by homeowner, is 5 years from data of purchase.
     
  5. BrandonV

    BrandonV LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,197

    thinking you get a lifetime warranty w/ a installer. how big of an area you doing? driveways or patio? if its a drive you'd be much better getting someone w/ the equipment and skills... if its a simple patio you might be able to tackle yourself.
     
  6. Paver Gangster

    Paver Gangster LawnSite Member
    Posts: 145

    Great. Another untrained dealer passing on mis-information to countless customers. There should be no argument. The dealer is wrong and you should tell them so.

    Even worse than telling this to contractors, some of whom know better, they are probably telling the same pablum to homeowners, so inform them they are ruining the credibility of contractors who must charge more because they do the job right, and putting that money in the hands of the fly-by-night tinkers.

    The more and more I hear these stories, the more I wonder if the ICPI needs to have a special one day certification for dealer staff.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2010
  7. DVS Hardscaper

    DVS Hardscaper LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 6,412

    All interlocking pavements must have 1 layer of fabric under the aggregate, and the fabric must be installed for the entire square footage of the interlocking paverment, not just "a small section...."

    I prefer Belgard's Arbel Stone over Techo's flagstone. The Arbel is more realistic in sizes, whereas Techos flagstone is too slendrical.


    ,
     
  8. Fiano Landscapes

    Fiano Landscapes LawnSite Member
    Posts: 69

    I have installed a couple different projects of old world and haven't had any problems. Around here they offer a lifetime warranty if the product is installed by a Belgard Authorized Contractor. There are a few certificates you need to qualify. I have a walkway of Old World at my personal residence, and haven't had any problems shoveling the walk also. Courtstone is far superior, but as you are experiencing very expensive.
    Posted via Mobile Device
     
  9. BOEpavers

    BOEpavers LawnSite Member
    Posts: 93

    Keep in mind most paver warranties that I am aware of (not familiar with Belgard) are on the product itself, and the labor to repair is generally not covered. So homeowner installed or authorized contractor installed, you're going to have the same product with the same "potential" warranty. I guess Belgard is downgrading the warranty in case a homeowner installs the product in some totally idiotic way that compromises the structural integrity of the product. Don't really see how that could be done, and to be honest I've seen many "contractors" not install product correctly. I know of 2 in my area (northeast, freeze/thaw, etc) that use no geotextile and stone dust for setting bed. Probably at least one or two times a year we get called to repair their work and it ends up costing the HO more that had they had a reputable contractor do it correctly the first time, but everyone looks at the $$$ and not the specs.
     
  10. Guinness56

    Guinness56 LawnSite Member
    Posts: 18

    Fiano Lanscapes,

    I appreciate your feedback.

    I see on your website you've done several installs of the Belgard Old World...it looks great. So, you've had no issues with people complaining while walking on it, etc? I swung by one of the distributors by me in NJ and they commented that in the past they had rust issues with Belgard pavers (in general)...usually 2 or 3 years later after the installation rust spots would occur. You could see it in his display area actually. It was an older display, however, and they may be past that. I also assume that's more of a local issue too. Ironically, he commented that he didn't like the feel while walking on them when he went to their plant.

    The Techo Villagio is a nice runner-up (looks-wise).

    I'm sure to install these to the letter when it comes to ICPI guidelines considering my engineering background and general attention to detail. This warranty thing has me frustrated, though. Techo has no difference from that point of view...which is causing me to lean that way.

    My wife is a big fan of the Belgard, though....damn!


    Joe
     

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