Big guys did it again.

Discussion in 'Pesticide & Herbicide Application' started by turf hokie, Jan 31, 2006.

  1. turf hokie

    turf hokie LawnSite Silver Member
    Posts: 2,744

    Went on a propery visit with local LCO who is using T/G to do his chems. He's not happy with the results.......and now I know why.

    First property we visit is 6.5 acres (I measured it) all wide open and fairly flat can be done with the Z and then the sidewalks blown off.

    T/G price per app $400 for 4 applications.

    My question. Can anybody even buy the fertilizer and weed control needed to do this site for $400 never mind the labor to apply it?

    He's going to see if he can make my numbers work within his budget and also go back to the customer and explain the situation further. Nobody is happy with them but for this price they may be willing to put up with substandard turf.
  2. topsites

    topsites LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 21,653

    I don't sub-contract, if it involves another company I don't want to deal with it, there's always bs and hassle.

    It does appear as a classic situation of something for nothing, maybe it's the LCo's fault he underbid, but maybe the customer doesn't want to pay more, who knows? If the LCO underbid, this should be good for education. If it was the customer, they got what they paid for and if they're not happy, that's a given.

    Now as for the stuff about going to see if they can work the numbers into the budget and explaining things... Bad news, it appears you should've quoted higher to keep those thoughts from even happening.
  3. turf hokie

    turf hokie LawnSite Silver Member
    Posts: 2,744

    My price is why they are going back to the customer. The bid was given 3 years ago using the TGCL numbers of $400 per app. After 3 years the results aren't there.

    The LCO wants to use me, b/c he knows my work. However, this particular site is underbid due to TGCL being too low at the time of the original bid.

    So the LCO is trying to make my number work. Whether he can get more out of the customer by explaining the better program I will provide is up to him. Either he finds the money for my program or they will continue getting subpar service from TGCL.

    My price is right.....and it isn't even in the ballpark of TGCL 's price of $400 per application.
  4. GrazerZ

    GrazerZ LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 670

    Thats amazing isn't it? $400.00 per app for 6.5 acres :dizzy: I would be about $1000.00 per app.
  5. cleancutccl

    cleancutccl LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 698

    1000.00 is our market as well. Just bid 5.2 acres at 850.00 per app. Have no idea what tg is doing here, but I know I have lost some bids to them. We also have a local guy that is trying to mimic them, even their prices.
  6. GreenUtah

    GreenUtah LawnSite Senior Member
    from SLC, UT
    Posts: 866

    $61.50 an acre is reasonable when you throw straight urea and minimum levels of weed control w/ no preemergent or insect/disease control. But this is the kind of program that ends up getting you fired as the weekly guy as it always flows right back to you. This is the point I'd explain to both the contractor and the customer. You see what cheap got you. It wasn't cutting it. In the overall yearly cost of the lawn, the propert amount is a very small piece, not worth losing the acount to scrimp on a proper program. This is especially useful speak with property managers.
  7. turf hokie

    turf hokie LawnSite Silver Member
    Posts: 2,744

    Everyone here seems to be on the same page as me. The LCO flat out knows they are doing for material cost. He isn't ignorant. He is 90% commercial and has quite a few properties for me, if he hasn't gotten lazy and just used TGCL pricing on all his properties. Hopefully, he was just taking their underbidding as gravy for himself, and I can get in with my prices. I have already learned the hard way that a big job is just a big job if your not getting the right price.

    My price was $1085 per application, so after seeing some guys say around 1000 just confirms that I am inline with what should be.

    I have run into their low prices before, but not to the point where it seems like they are either doing it below cost(which we know they aren't) or they are skipping apps or as Green Utah said straight urea with nothing else.

    Just thought I would share this, cause it kinda blew me out of the water when he told me what it was being done for.
  8. Pilgrims' Pride

    Pilgrims' Pride LawnSite Senior Member
    from MA.
    Posts: 481

    I have been trying to get in to a condo complex a little north of me for about 3 years now.
    Same deal as you. They have been using TG for several seasons. The place always looks like crap at any given time of year.
    The condo assoc. calls me EVERY YEAR and asks for bids.
    TG is about 2/3 less than me on a very large property.
    They tell me every year that I'm more expensive and ask me to "sharpen my pencil a bit" I remind them that there is a reason they called again and that mine is a fair and honest price not some off the wall quote from some foolish salesman.

    maybe they'll get off their wallet this year. Maybe not.

    Do I understand that you let someone else bid for you?
    Not good.
  9. FINN

    FINN LawnSite Senior Member
    from PA.
    Posts: 280

    What did the bid specs call for on these 4 apps?
  10. LawnTamer

    LawnTamer LawnSite Gold Member
    Posts: 3,988

    TGCL is charging $1.43/k. You or you buddy should explain to the client that the reason they are not happy with TGCL is because there is no way they could be doing anything but the bare minimum, a little N, some 3-way. Show them the cost of using quality materials N, Ph, K, Fe, micronutrients, Barricade, or split Dimension/Pendi apps and quality weed control. No Way TGCL's loosing $$$.

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