Certainty

Discussion in 'Pesticide & Herbicide Application' started by GALAWN, Apr 21, 2014.

  1. greendoctor

    greendoctor LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 9,062

    Now I feel ghetto. Peanut butter and chocolate for me.
     
  2. greendoctor

    greendoctor LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 9,062

    I never heard of it either until Revolver got approved for use on residential turf. MSO is a solvent. Meaning the AI can dissolve into the oil phase and then penetrate into plant tissues. This might be a bit much when dealing with new growth emerging from winter dormancy. However, in the South and Tropics, what if that growth has been there long enough to harden off? I get to spray weeds that might have been there for more than a year. Grassy weeds do not die on their own here, they become perennial. Neither do broadleaves. Water based surfactants will make the spray wet the leaf surfaces. Whether it penetrates that hardened off weed is negotiable. Side by side, there is a difference. Not in burn, but in control of the target species.
     
  3. Turf Dawg

    Turf Dawg LawnSite Gold Member
    Posts: 3,719

    Whew we Doc

    You are going to need to take a trip to the Lone Star State this summer and go to the Texas stop sign (Dairy Queen) and get yourself a Reeses peanut butter cup Blizzard.

    Oh, sorry that flavor maybe wrong. Better check with someone who knows more than us
    Posted via Mobile Device
     
  4. greendoctor

    greendoctor LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 9,062

    Mine is Ben and Jerry's. I doubt that flavor is wrong. Sounds about right to me.
     
  5. ted putnam

    ted putnam LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,539

    We have Peach orchards all over this county. I'm not too much on peach flavored ice cream but fresh peaches on vanilla ice cream is the "bomb" My favorite is Pralines'n cream though. I guess its a "southern" thing.

    Sometimes you do things because they work for you and you like the end result even though others think its all wrong.
     
  6. greendoctor

    greendoctor LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 9,062

    Pralines and cream with dark chocolate shavings on it.
     
  7. Skipster

    Skipster LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,074

    I get a kick out of you guys who think that you're somehow outsmarting the product or the manufacturer recommendations. You mix a bit of some new surfactant recommended to you online by someone you've never met or by some chemical distributor salesman (who may have been selling toilets at the Home Depot the week before) and you think you've stumbled onto something that is super effective that no one else has tried before. The, you use it once and declare it the best thing since sliced bread based on your sample size of 1. Forgive me if I have a hard time understanding why someone would base his business decisions (that have impact on how you feed your family) on hearsay and a sample size of 1. That line of thinking is very similar to the line about rate, that if the recommended rate is good, more must be better.

    Did you conduct controlled replicated experiments over several years and several different management schemes and weather patterns to determine if you actually were getting better control with MSO and that what you saw wasn't due to some other factor?

    Perhaps you didn't know that before Certainty was brought to the T&O market, it was tested extensively. My contract research firm did a lot of the early work with this product and conducted the lab experiments in conjunction with several universities. Every single testing lab happened to see the same results with respect to surfactants: they all (several NIS products, MSO, COC, UAN, Amm Sulf, and several organosilicones) had the same droplet spread (measure of leaf wetting), the same penetration time, and the same amount of herbicide uptake into leaves, stems, and roots. It didn't matter which one you used -- none of them improved Certainty uptake, speed of symptomology, or activity over any other. But, MSO stood out as having the worst off-target effects. So, MSO won't harm the efficacy, but it won't make it any better. AND, it gives more opportunity to harm your desirable grass.

    MSO has always been recommended for quinclorac products because MSO has specifically shown in research (field AND lab research) to improve uptake and efficacy. But, it doesn't do that for every herbicide. It certainly doesn't do it for sulfosulfuron.

    I make the statements that I do so that someone reading this board knows at least some of the facts. I'm not disagreeing with green"doc" (what's his doctorate in, by the way?) just to say something different. I just don't want anyone to be lead astray by poor advice and untrue reasoning. I like to base my business decisions on confident and reliable evidence, not on hearsay and a sample size of 1.
     
  8. Turf Dawg

    Turf Dawg LawnSite Gold Member
    Posts: 3,719

    I like what works best for me.

    #msoandpeachicecream

    I am a legend in my own mind too
    Posted via Mobile Device
     
  9. ted putnam

    ted putnam LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,539

     
  10. ted putnam

    ted putnam LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,539



    Bill, you're too much...LMAO
     

Share This Page