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Discussion in 'Heavy Equipment & Pavement' started by shaughnessylawn, Jan 1, 2005.
change a new hooland from foot controls to joy stick do u know where I can find them and price
Try New Hooland dealer
Trade for a Caterpillar you will end up with a better tractor over all and have the controls you are looking to get. Thier system is patented and revolutionizing the way other companies do buisness, the same way so many Cat products have done over the years.
No one I know of makes an aftermarket product that even comes close.
I'm not quite sure NH itself offers such a conversion kit... but definitely ask your dealer about it. NH will come out with better controls sometime this year, date TBA.
Or... just get a Cat, as Uniscaper mentioned.
Sorry but I have to hijack this thread.
I am not sure what CAT is revolutionizing. Pilot controls are not revolutionizing anything. CAT was first to market Pilot controls in a Backhoe. They certainly didn't revolutionize the backhoe, and if you've run a D series you know partially why (slow and can't multifunction very well). The other reason is manually actuated systems aren't so bad as to make pilot controls that advantageous. Yes others have Pilot control options now (both superior to CATs, but of course easy to build a better system when your not the first to market it, I know) . I would equate it to power steering in a car. Did it make it easier to steer? Yes. Did it revolutionize the automobile? No. Can the average car owner tell you who was first to market power steering. No. does it matter? No. CAT certainly isn't changing the way anyone does business. Considering CAT was so late to the market, I would have expected something more ground breaking than what they brought. Takeuchi (sorry, I know its "jap") can claim more firsts than CAT can in the skid steer market. When CAT owns 50 percent of the skid steer market, feel free to use the term "revolutionary", then it may have some meaning. One quick note on CATs patented system. The components used in CATs control system are commercially available to anyone that wants them. The way in which they are put together maybe proprietary, but the components are not (at least not by CAT or any other skid steer manufacturer). Which is a good thing for CAT, as they would have had to work around Takeuchi's pilot controlled machine. I am not looking for a great debate nor am I looking to *iss anyone off, but such a blanket statement that is so incorrect can't be left unaddressed. As a side, I have nothing against CAT, and use their equipment from time to time. If you were talking motor graders or scrapers, I would probably agree with you.
I have to agree, for the most part, as well. Cat certainly didn't do very much to ignite the skid steer industry; if anything, Case, Deere, and Bobcat had innovations far surpassing Cat's attempt. Also -- notice how similar Cat's design (basics, not the specifics) is to Bobcat's... anyone else find it uncanny that the 246 looked almost exactly like an 863, even down to the lift arm specs?
However -- Cat's skid steers are still "different" in their own right. While Takeuchi (you spelled it correctly, Kaiser) may have put the first pilot controls in some sort of wheel compact equipment, Cat was the first American manufacturer to put them in a skid steer. Most people operating Cat skid steers either hadn't run them before or switched from Bobcat -- and of course pilot controls are easy to get used to if never run before; even more so, they're a dream come true if switching from foot controls (for most people)! Imagine going from a fleet of all mechanically-actuated, swash-plated machines to a fleet with pilot controls... quite a difference it would have made. I don't believe Cat's skids are the BEST in the market, but I would argue that in introducing pilot controls, they made getting into their line a lot easier. After all, why would anyone buy a repainted Bobcat if the original could be repainted itself?
As for having something against Cat -- for you Cat employees out there who are reading this: nothing against you PERSONALLY. I'm not sure Cat will be able to continue being a leader in the construction equipment field if it doesn't start to get some innovation down. Kaiser mentioned motor graders. While Cat's tend to be the staple in the industry, both Volvo (formerly Champion), Deere, and Komatsu can make the claim that their machines are smoother and more refined, a statement that I have to agree with. Cat's line hasn't undergone a serious revision since 1994, when the H-series first came out. Scrapers, heh, yeah, I think Cat still leads the field. (It does.) ADTs are cutting into the scraper market, but in the scraper market itself, I'm not sure anyone, not even Deere, can lift a finger. Overall, I think Cat's product line is somewhat stagnant. Their machines might have brute force or power, but smoothness, or multifunctionality as Kasier mentioned, seems to be lacking in a few areas. It's the reason people love Deere dozers and wheel loaders. Don't get me wrong; Cat is and probably always will be my favorite company. But if there's a company that should have looked up and noticed the competition running around suddenly (Deere.. :cough cough: ), it should have been Cat.
The final point I wanted to make in regards to Kaiser's reply -- both Cat, Deere, and Komatsu should have come out with better skid steers, Deere especially, given the time they put in. I can't quite see any advantage to taking a Komatsu other than better visibility. If there will be a skid steer to have serious fatigue issues, I'd predict it to be Komatsu's line. Their boom arms are just about cantilevered as boom arms can get. However, given the relative market when each was introduced, I think Cat did a wonderful job. They've certained gained a loyal following and have gotten some Bobcat owners seeing yellow now. All three lines, however, could have been refined a bit more.
My purpose for mentioning the Motor Grader and Scraper was because they were, in my opinion, revolutionary CAT designs upon inception. Whether they have stayed on top of the market is another story. Certainly CAT lost its dozer market to Deere which 10 years prior (prior to Deeres new Hydrostat machines) I would have never guessed would happen. CAT SSL have done some things very well. I can say after comparing the various machines side by side. CAT's attention to service points is second to none. I liked the CAT switches in the machine way better than the push button panel found on Bobcat and more substantial than CASE buttons. We all have seen what a Bobcat control panel looks like after a 1000 hours and about 250,000 depressions made on the release button. I did not want to come across as anti CAT because I am not. I believe that for guys that run CAT SSL because they own all CAT heavy equipment or guys who want to be associated with CAT equipment they are a fine machine. Your point on the controls is well made, for someone walking into a machine for the first time they are low effort and responsive. CAT did not fall on its face like Deere did on its first attempt. However, to be fair to Deere, CAT played it very safe by using a very similiar design used by the number one SSL manufacturer, which put itself in a better position to spend more time and money on a control system. Probably a smart move. However, pilot controls alone will not revolutionize the SSL industry. CATs machine as it stands now will not be looked back on and thought of as revolutionizing the SSL industry. CAT's execution of their machine (SSL) will be looked back upon as a successful launch of a new machine, just not a revolutionary machine which changed the SSL industry. Bobcat who brought the SSL to town in the first place certainly earns top honors for revolutionizing the SSL industry. One could possibly make an arguement that New Holland is responsible for bringing vertical lift to the market, now that may have been revolutionary. If someone could design a composite track that wears like steel and has the properties of rubber that may revolutionize the market by making wheeled machines obsolete. CAT's contributions (so far) are not that significant. IMHO
Agreed! Hehe, this was a great thread.