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Discussion on fertilizer choices

Discussion in 'Organic Lawn Care' started by Hamons, Apr 27, 2004.

  1. Hamons

    Hamons LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 706

    TimTurf and I are having a discussion about which fertilizers would be the best to build into my lawncare program.

    I have found a very good organic fertilizer sold by agri-nutrients.

    It is calleD Mo-Gro --- 4-2-5 2%Fe 20% Humates MOP - around $7/bag at my door. I would put it into a program that would look something like this

    (March) 15-1-10 (.1 Dim) ---------5#/m--------.75-.05-.5 ($.28#)
    (June) 4-2-5---------------------10#/m--------.40-.02-.5
    (Sept) 4-2-5----------------------25#/m---------1.0-.50-1.5
    (Nov) 15-1-10 -------------------6.5#/m---- ---1.0-.06-.65
    ==============================================
    Annual Total ----3.15-.64-3.15


    a little more potash then I need and a little less p.2.5 -- but overall Ithink it would be a nice program.

    This compared toa more conventional bridged organic 15-3-6, 50% biosolids, scu, sop, muraite of potash. which cost $14.00.

    What are your thoughts?
     
  2. TurfProSTL

    TurfProSTL LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 693

    Do you have any concerns about putting down that much MOP in September? I would personally feel a little better using SOP.....
     
  3. the 15 -3 -6 has 2.5 units of n is win from biosolids, and 6.0 units of n is controled slow release from scu. total fert is 56.6% slow release.

    I too would be concerned about 1.5 lbs/m of muraite of potash in september!

    I think the .64 p2o5 is adequate for a lawn that clipping are returned and soil p is in normal range.

    march 15-1-10 .75n .05p .50k mop or sop?
    june 15-3-6 .45n .09p .18k mop and sop
    sept 15-3-6 1.05n .21p .42k mop and sop
    nov 15-1-10 .90n .06p .60k mopor sop?
    total 3.15n .41p 1.31k

    this program I feel doesn't give enough k

    Jeff, more details on 15-1-10 dim and 15-1-10. any slow release, any organic?

    Why so much humate, 20% or7 lbs/m for season? What are the benefits of humate?
     
  4. Hamons

    Hamons LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 706

    15-1-10 is 50% organic from biosolids other from urea, and mop

    Yes I have same concern about MOP would much rather have sop.

    I have very little actual experience with humates and have a hard time finding any true research on it. Only information on the websites if from the salesman. They reccommend 5-7# of humates per application.
     
  5. ChickensDoo

    ChickensDoo LawnSite Member
    Posts: 108

    Hammons,
    For comprehensive info on Humates try www.organicapproach.com or www.teravita.com. These folks are the best source of information and humates i am aware of.
    Their are some big differences in Humate's on the market. and specifically what is the source Leonarditeetc. I would suggest you call Eric Danese with Organic approach.
    Not only do they sell the products, More importantly they use them in their Lawn Service division
    I believe you can order some of the Nutrients plus products through them with their humates added.
     
  6. Hamons

    Hamons LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 706

    I have talked with Eric personally -- very informative guy. I have also spoke directly with Nutrients plus. Good products. but.... they also are selling their products!

    Nutrients plus is too expensive when shipped to KS.
     
  7. Catmann

    Catmann LawnSite Member
    Posts: 93

    Bottom line is you really need to throw out the concept that plants needs so many "units" of this and that. Plants and soils are dynamic and constantly changing. Biological activity is paramount to anything else. Everything a plant needs is derived from biological activity.

    MOP is worthless for anyone in this "organic" forum as it is KCL. Chlorine will kill biological activity in very small doses, so what is the point of using organic materials to feed the microbes and then killing them with KCL?????

    I do not know the Agri-Products stuff personally, but it seems there is nothing on their site focused on organics, so I am curious what the Mo-gro product is made from. Regardless, Leonardite is what would be in the product, not Humates (which are by definition soluble "salts" of humic acid. I have no problem with Leonardite as a soil conditioner or as a microbial food source, just do not expect it to do what true "humates" do in terms of providing available carbon, immediate chelation, soil structuring, etc. etc. See the teravita.com site for specifics about what they are.

    As for Kansas shipping, yes it is true it is more expensive to get product there. If you can use/order 10 pallets, pricing should be better, but for less it would have to be on a per quote basis. Shoot a volume and a zip and I can shoot a delivered price.

    Nutrients Plus is an excellent product - well designed to deliver what Nature needs. It is true there are many products in the marketplace these days, but from my experience, most of them are not "designed" to deliver specific parameters of carbon/nitrogen, organic matter, WSN vs WIN, etc. Nutrients Plus had all of these thought in the design stage and the products work well, so it would be my first choice in the organic realm.

    That is not to say other products cannot or will not work. There are many possibilites and methodologies that can be employed in lawn care.

    I am going to post my little "article" on our site for you all to read. It is not visible from any other place, so you must click here to read it (too many copyright thieves out there!) If I see the info appear anywhere else I am coming after you! Just kidding!

    http://www.organicapproach.com/Tempfiles.htm:D
     
  8. ChickensDoo

    ChickensDoo LawnSite Member
    Posts: 108

    Hamons, Eric Danese,
    I am Glad the two of you have spoken. I agree with what Eric said in his last post reguarding tossing some of the traditional n,p,k, benchmarks to the side.
    And focus on the O. M. and C:N ratio to feed the soil.
    I m ay be biased but i do believe Nutrients plus combines the best of both worlds in plant nutrient from quality sources, and Organic Matter.
    I wholeheartedly agree that mop and kcl are not desired for the health of the soil.
     
  9. dishboy

    dishboy LawnSite Platinum Member
    from zone 6
    Posts: 4,004

    Chickendoo: I am guesing muriate of Potash = MOP?

    Excuse my ignorance, but what are the negative results of using MOP?

    Also would a grass/leaf compost collected from all the local Gardners [my tomates loved it] be a good source of organic matter, and would you have any idea what such a compost would be in NPK?
    Any info is appreciated!

    Tom
     
  10. hammons,

    Is the 15-1-10 same fert, but spring has dim added?

    What % of 15-1-10 is contolled slow release n for both spring and fall applications?

    eric, good info at organic approach!
     

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