I killed Bermuda in St Augustine

Discussion in 'Pesticide & Herbicide Application' started by gregory, Dec 31, 2009.

  1. greendoctor

    greendoctor LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 8,826

    No, the actual dosage per acre is well under safe limits for st augustine. 3 oz of a product that is 50% dicamba is way less than what I routinely apply, which is 8 oz of 4 lb/gallon dicamba amine.
     
  2. Ric

    Ric LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 11,946

    Karl

    In regards to Celsius, Yes Price will be a factor. Remember that one product we looked at that was $ 800.00. While the price per thousands wasn't all that bad. The purchase price was a cash flow killer for a spot treatment. But do the math as Greendoctor suggested on Dicamba. I did because it caught my attention also. But we are 0.117 oz per thousand or 0.06 oz of Dicamba at the highest rate.

    Greendoctor

    You are saying the same thing that I had a conversation about with a CPO friend. With MSMA etc gone we think many Ag labeled product will get residential labeling. Also Chem companies have stuff on the shelf that they will be releasing now that they have a better market at higher prices. Look for more Celsius type produces soon. But at super high prices.

    Karl

    The pictures look great. I am not sure if you froze last night. But if you took these pictures today, you didn't get a freeze. I missed the freezing point, but was very close. Where is Al Gore and Global Warming. last week we had 80 degree weather and this next week is predicted to be like Canada or some other god awful place. It is only 47 degrees in the middle of today. From my experiment with this mixture I have never had cold weather to deal with. So I am not sure how today's treatment is going to work. Oh well you are my Beta Tester so I may have supply you with more chemicals.
     
  3. greendoctor

    greendoctor LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 8,826

    Ric, there is even stuff out there that has had a long track record in other countries coming this way. Check this out. http://www.pbigordon.com/professional/page.php?id=907 I know this herbicide has been on the market in Japan for over 5 years. Safe to use on bermuda and zoysia, good on a lot of the weeds MSMA was used for, but not cheap.
     
  4. gregory

    gregory LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,068

    ric while it was cool or cold here at my house i did not get any frost or freezer here as of yet. i still have green berumda in my yard that has not been treated with your mixture so i would think the berumda has not gone dormant as of yet
     
  5. Turf Dawg

    Turf Dawg LawnSite Gold Member
    Posts: 3,720

    I hope the price on the Celsius is not too heafty, because for the Dallis grass it states it needs to be mixed with Revolver which has a expensive initial cost. But also it would be nice for the lawns that have mixed grasses. Also might be able to charge more if it works and nobody else is offering it.
     
  6. Ric

    Ric LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 11,946

    Greendoctor

    I have a list of TO WATCH chemicals and will add this one. Chemical Companies are FOR PROFIT corporations and will only release products that they feel can make a killing for them.

    Karl

    It was 80 last week. Ground temperature has a lot to do with Bermuda going dormant and coming out of it's dormant state. I have never seen Bermuda go completely dormant in our area. While we do have a year round growing season, winter growing season is effected by hours of day light and Ground Temperature. Weeds are best controlled when actively growing. Therefore this being my baby I am worried that this cold snap might effect the response.

    Turf Dawg

    With 4th generation Chemicals I have found price per gallon is very high but price per thousand gets more reasonable. But don't expect anything to get cheaper.
     
  7. greendoctor

    greendoctor LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 8,826

    Once Image, Halosulfuron and all of the other sulfonlyurea herbicides came onto the market, cost went out the window. It became a matter of what worked without making the lawn look like a missile test site. I still remember what it was like trying to control purple nutsedge before those herbicides were around. Multiple applications of MSMA on zoysia or bermuda that made the lawns look really burnt and you were SOL if purple nutsedge came up in grasses that MSMA could not be used on. There are still many unlicensed applicators who would rather use MSMA on a lawn because it was sold for around $15 a quart here. When the ban kicks in for residential and commercial turf at the close of 2010, it will be interesting to see what more is offered. It was hard for chemical companies to compete with cheap, given the number of mental midgets who care for lawns. I do not even bat an eye when something costs $100 an ounce. As long as it works, the fact I use those products routinely sets me apart. The only caveat is how most new offerings are sulfonlyureas. Already, there are many reports of Revolver being useless against some populations of goosegrass here in Hawaii. There are other options such as Sencor, simazine, atrazine or preemergents, however the relative convenience and safety to desirable turf made it too convenient to overuse Revolver.
     
  8. RAlmaroad

    RAlmaroad LawnSite Silver Member
    from SC
    Posts: 2,162

    Karl or Ric:
    Does either of you know whether or not the "Celsius" is available or if not any word when. Seems like a product that will help with the Dallisgrass in St. Augustine. According to the label, we may have missed the window for the Dallisgrass. Thanks
     
  9. Ric

    Ric LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 11,946

    Good Doctor

    It is called keeping up with the times. Years ago I could tank mix several herbicides with my Insecticide and Fungicide as well as Fertilizer and apply them all with one shot. A gallon of Herbicide was under $ 100 but the rate per thousand was higher and the cost per thousand wasn't really a bargain.

    Today the Price per Gallon is much higher but the rate per thousand can be 1/100 of the older herbicides making the cost per thousand in some cases less. But most 4th generation herbicide work better when applied at a Gallon per thousand of mixed solution. I my case this requires a special application at the one gallon per thousand rate.

    The infinite number of Chemicals you need to inventory to do competitive work is no bargain to start with. With today's chemical cost per gallon being higher, Cost of keeping a ready supply has gone way up. In many cases some of these Chemicals go bad before they can be used.
     
  10. gregory

    gregory LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,068

    i agree ric i wish some of the companys would make them in smaller sizes i had half a bottle of dismiss go bad and i had to throw away but they now make dismiss in a 8oz bottle instead of a 16oz bottle....
     

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