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michigan lawn posting regulations to change

Discussion in 'Pesticide & Herbicide Application' started by tlg, Feb 25, 2008.

  1. tlg

    tlg LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 645

    Met with MIAG today. Posting flags will have big changes effective march of 2008. New flags must be rigid. meaning no poly flags . they must be 4x 5 inches with the traditional green lettering on a white background printed now on both sides with the caution: pesticide application logo. your company name can't be anywhere on the flag and you can't use or post a lawn that you DON'T apply a pesticide to. Posting on a fertilizer only application would be considered a violation. posting flags currently on hand will be allowed to be used as there will be a grace period to allow you to use up old stock. I voiced my opposition to these changes today. MIAG wants to eliminate the use of some of the large advertising posting signs some companies have been using. anybody got any thoughts on this
  2. RigglePLC

    RigglePLC LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 12,225

    You are so right! This new regulation is a pain in the butt--probably sponsored by some company that makes the markers they want. Only applies to us--not to homeowners regardless of how toxic the product applied. Not to farmers, because they have a better lobby.

    Michigan has so many problems. Business and people leaving at a rapid rate. Why would the Dept of Ag waste the taxpayers money? Why would they waste valuble staff time and paper, producing yet another regulation on business? Other states didn't see the need to do this.

    I dislike the new cardboard markers--you can't let them get wet. In case of rain, or wind, you can't carry them on the back of your truck or open trailer. Main problem is that they take up a huge amount of room in your truck. If you have two guys, one of them has to carry the cardboard box of flags on his lap. Plastic is sourced from petrochemicals, so the staffs do not decompose ever. With the plastic staffs, you have to assemble the product--snap it together. I imagine more kids suffer eye injuries playing with the sharp plastic staffs than were ever injured by walking across treated lawns.

    There was nothing wrong with the green and white flags. They were effective--millions put out and no one died from walking across a treated lawn--so why change something that was working? I have hundreds to use up yet.

    Off the soapbox--done.
  3. Runner

    Runner LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 13,494

    Ok,...so if if I ordered 10,000 flags from Blackburn with my logo on it and the size of a small billboard, for about 400 accounts, I guess I'm good for about 4 years then, right?
    And why in the WORLD would they not us (or let's better yet say want us to NOT) put a flag on a lawn just because t has straight fert. on it? There are still many people who do not want their poodle walking on the neighbors yard as they are taking their neighborhood walk.
    the sam thin with them not wanting a company name or number. It seems to me that it wold be HELPful to have it on tere, so that wy, if there are any questions by anyone (neighbors), they have access to your number without having to knock on the door of the customer.
    This is just another fine example, just like the questions that ar written in the study books, of complete ignorance to what is relevant. You can tell these things are done by people who have NEVER BEEN OUT IN THE FIELD or have NEVER SPRAYED anything in their entire lives. they have studied in some college classes, and that is it....which has NOTHING to do with practical use or logic.
  4. tlg

    tlg LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 645

    My feelings exactly. At our meeting I raised the question of who came up with this plan. MIAG claimed that industry input was part of the process and helped to formulate the new regs. They don't say who. Sure wasn't't me. The fact of the matter is that its just wrong. They believe this simplifies things for everybody involved when in reality this will cause everybody more time, money and grief. By the way they are saying that some sort of flag without any pesticide info may be allowed on fertilizer only apps. I guess that's one more thing in the truck.
  5. grassguy_

    grassguy_ LawnSite Senior Member
    from Ohio
    Posts: 633

    ask them to provide you and everyone else in Michigan the documentation demonstrating their "industry input as part of the process", be interesting who's sponsoring something like this. My guess is, they'll blow smoke up your backside just like alot of these presidential candidates. Imagine next what will come down for us all to deal with, beyond these regs, fert prices skyrocketing, and you can't talk to anyone on the phone anymore because of the "DO NOT CALL" list. Hmmmmm, maybe we're heading towards communism, while China's reaping the benefits of capitalism....think about that!............. Oh well got snow to clear!
  6. tlg

    tlg LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 645

    The problem is these things get put threw without any thought of the impact on it's usage. The intent is to elimanate "billboard advertising lawn posting signs" and prohibit posting fertilized only lawns with a pesticide posting sign.If big brother would have just enforced the current regulation there would be no problem. Those companies that side stepped the regulations buy using these giant signs were the problem. The old reg was clear. These politicians and bureaucrats are not only blowing smoke... their on fire! It getting harder everyday to make a decent profit. What's next chinese flags with english and spanish on them.:usflag:
  7. MStine315

    MStine315 LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 789

    That's the thing that jumps out at me. You have to leave contact information on the property at the time of application anyway, so why are we hiding this? I'm guessing it's these "billboard" flags guys are using where you can hardly see the circle slash in amongst all the graphics. Anyway, why not give us the option of name and number and regulate font and placement. Then again, why waste time second guessing Jenny's regime?
  8. RigglePLC

    RigglePLC LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 12,225

    Bear in mind, the people and jobs making these signs are all out of state. We are just sending more money to Nebraska.
  9. esurient_one

    esurient_one LawnSite Member
    Posts: 12

    Thanks Masters Green!

    Im not sure where everyone here is at, but I can think of at least a couple companies locally that made this law completely understandable.

    I know I've even seen coupons and no PEST WARNINGS on a few of them from TG. Im assuming these were fert only apps.

    Regardless of who shot who, it probably is something that needed to happen anyway.

    Also, I know its a slippery slope, but I would still think leaving a flag would still be a good idea on fert only apps. Im pretty sure my customers would appreciate it as well. Do you think Dept of Ag would really take the time to check on something so ridiculous? I sincerely doubt it.
  10. Runner

    Runner LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 13,494

    Well, a COUPLE of good points were brought up about not flagging at all for a fert only ap. this is just stupid. For one, how many times have you ever pulled up to do a job, and it was already done. Without a flag, there is no way of telling...so if and when tru-brown pulls up and does their famous "final application" or two, 4 to 6 weeks after they were canceled, we can go in and just totally roast the lawn...the bad thing about it? WE would be responsible, as tru-brown would not only deny it, but say "That job was canceled weeks prior to that."
    Another thing that is bad about this, is that MANY people don't even use their front doors. They pull in after work, and drive up their drive, and right into their garage. Atleast with a flag by the driveway, they can tell we were there, and to check the door for their sos.
    Like I say, these rules and laws are made up by people who have NEVER fertilized or sprayed a lawn in their entire life. They haven't a CLUE about what needs to be implemented out in the field for actual practicality.

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