natty thanks for the link. green gardien the active ingredients are 1% citric acid ...." 1% 2-phenethyl propionat" a flavor additive for food, i think derived from peanuts + it's used as an insecticide in the real world and a insect attractant for Japanese beetles" What about atracting grubs on turf? 1% lauryl sulfate " shampoo" and the label says the corn soluble and molasses" the sticker agent i think?" and urea are the inert ingredients? tell me how does that suppress weeds? just wondering? their natures fed the one with 5/0/3 is just fert to me unless it's spray able cgm. as it says derived from corn solubles and molasses their every thing most go has 35% 2-phenethyl propionat and 1%lauryl sulfate and 5% garlic that sound more to me like an insecticide. but I never have tried it so the jury's still out to me You have experience with those? can you please comment on their defectiveness?