Organics, All or Nothing?

Discussion in 'Organic Lawn Care' started by aclane2000, Jan 13, 2011.

  1. Smallaxe

    Smallaxe LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 10,080

    See what I mean... To me it looks like those salts were dissolved and settled into the low spot in one picture, and acroos the top of the other field entirely.
    Where were those pictures taken and is it really salt??
     
  2. phasthound

    phasthound LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,567

    Good, since I know you've done your homework, tell us in your own words what happens when organic matter is decomposed?
     
  3. Tim Wilson

    Tim Wilson LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 795

    JD, I was just trying to be nice and let you off the hook, rather than pick apart the phrasing you used. I was referencing my misunderstanding of what the heck you meant by your statement;
    Do you mean that microbes make the same ions as are found in fertilizers or do you mean that microbes (themselves) produce the ions which are in fertilizers. The latter means that microbes are utilized to produce synthetic fertilizers.

    Why do you instead use this to attempt to belittle? I’ve already stated my stance in one of the two current threads on the subject.

    You continue to speak from a standpoint of ignorance. Just because the molecular structure of synthetic ions and natural ions are similar and just because various bacteria feed on ions in synthetic fertilizers does not equate to; there is nothing wrong with using synthetics supposedly responsibly or correctly.
     
  4. Kiril

    Kiril LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 18,298

    What is this ..... biology 101? :rolleyes:

    Decompose = break down into constituent parts.
     
  5. JDUtah

    JDUtah LawnSite Silver Member
    from UT
    Posts: 2,636

    lol Kiril I know you know you are dodging the bullet. :laugh:

    And quit honestly it appears like two of you need a refresher course in... biology 101.

    It is basic stuff after all.

    BTW I am still waiting for an answer. Do soil microbes use the same ions as are found in synthetic fertilizers?
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2011
  6. Kiril

    Kiril LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 18,298

    In both cases the salt deposition is most likely due to E(T) exceeding precipitation. The second pic is in India, not sure where the first one is. Here is one from CO.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Kiril

    Kiril LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 18,298

    Tell me JD ... what exactly do I need to be refreshed on?

    Perhaps you would care to explain how microbes produce the very same ions as are found in synthetic fertilizers? You made the statement .... now clarify it.

    And with respect to your sad attempt at deflection, I have no intention of entertaining your ridiculous straw man argument.
     
  8. ICT Bill

    ICT Bill LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,115

    what is interesting about this debate every time it comes up is that no one seems to listen

    almost (maybe everything) everything that hits the soil is food for something, be it fertilizer, dead mouse or an old shoe. The microbial populations will increase to the point of how they can exist with the food available, case in point is the oil spill spring 2010 in the gulf, the microbe population that likes to eat oil exploded and consumed a majority of the oil that was spilled after the food was consumed there is typically a huge die off and those dead microbes are consumed by something else

    If you are applying fertilizers you are selecting for the microbes that like to eat fertilizer, if you are applying a diverse food like compost or a ferment of many inputs, kelp, fish, sugars, carbohydrates, amino acids you are selecting for a much wider variety of microorganisms and the higher predators that consume them and the ones that consume them and the ones that consumes them

    It is about the type of food that you are applying to get the best result, one thing that is often forgotten is that the plants themselves are also feeding the microbes in the soil through exudates and in turn making nutrients plant available in the soil to the plant, these symbiotic relationships in the soil, when nurtured, can be a powerful way to reduce inputs
     
  9. Kiril

    Kiril LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 18,298

    Or read studies posted.

    I for one can not even begin to pretend I have complete knowledge of plant-soil-microbe-environment interactions, even with my educational background, no one in their right mind would. On the other hand, it would appear JD does have this knowledge that no one else possesses and fully understands all of these complex interactions .... pretty damned amazing. :rolleyes:
     
  10. ICT Bill

    ICT Bill LawnSite Platinum Member
    Posts: 4,115

    Its hard to be specific with such a complicated subject, there are WAY too many variables, we can generalize and kind of get close
     

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