Slice-seed jobs

Discussion in 'Pesticide & Herbicide Application' started by Victor, Oct 29, 2007.

  1. Victor

    Victor LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,430

    The weather we've had this year has made doing slice-seed jobs an absolute nightmare for me. I've gotten horrible results on most of the jobs I did this year. To try and match the grass most of my customers have in their lawns, I used a high quality blend of 90% KGB and 10% PRG. You'll always have those customers that refuse to water their grass seed properly, but I have some that seemed to be pretty good about properly watering the seed I put down. It's going to be hard to a customer that will never let the seed dry, but I had quite a few that seemed to try and keep moisture in the top level of their soil.
    After this year, I'm thinking I'm going to have to switch over to all Perennial Rye blends from now on.
    I used this exact seed at my house to fill in a 40', by 7' bare spot and had great results. I did a good job though of keeping the seed moist. I wonder though, how much of my success was due to my diligent watering of the seed and how much of my success was due to me having better soil at my house. Most of the lawns I seeded were sodded lawns that had failed sections of turf I was trying to fill in.
    I seeded these people around Labor Day and put down a good starter fert for them, but like I said, the results have been horrible. Of course, the 90 degree weather we had deep into October this year didn't help either. Oh well. What do you guys think?
     
  2. Marcos

    Marcos LawnSite Gold Member
    Posts: 3,720

    ALL perennial rye for residential turf in C. Ohio? Wow, it's easy to see that you came from a golf course backround! There's certainly no question that you'd be able to make the yards pop like popcorn, but how are you going to deal with the turf disease issues, at the homeowner level, without sending them all to O.S.U's field day?
     
  3. Victor

    Victor LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,430

    Lol.. Who said I came from a golf course background? I'm just frustrated with properly slicing in a KBG heavy blend of seed and having extremely poor results on almost every lawn, even though some of my customers were good about watering properly. The best KBG seed won't do me a bit of good if it never comes up. It's hard to ignore the merits of using a type of seed with the kind of seedling vigor a lot of perennial rye varieties have. You do realize that there are some varieties of perennial rye that are gray leaf spot resistant don't you? When I sell a seed job, I want to have confidence that I'll deliver good results if the customer follows my instructions.
     
  4. Marcos

    Marcos LawnSite Gold Member
    Posts: 3,720

    Well, sorry, I was just going with an educated guess with your back round....having a big golf ball on your blog screen, and being named 'Par 5 Lawn Care'!

    Yes, I am VERY familiar with perennial ryes. And there ARE some very good ones on or near the top of the ntep.org 2007 grass seed report card to choose from, and I'm sure they'll get even better next year. Leaf spot is just one of the disease problems that p. rye has a problem with, though. Have you ever seen typical summertime brown patch damage on straight ryegrass turf? It's not pretty! :cry: And like bluegrass, p. rye is thin bladed, not allowing for as much air movement around it as would, say, T.T.T fescue. This is also a contributing factor to disease influx in rye.

    But the real problem with using straight p.ryegrass in this climate lies inherently in the nature of the growth pattern of the grass itself. Unlike bluegrass, ryegrass is not rhizomous, and although bluegrass suffers and strains to make it sometimes, it does manage to reproduce itself in this manner. Not the case at all for rye. When you have 'travel' or 'foot' traffic damage on rye, you HAVE to repair it! Wheras with bluegrass, it often will repair itself somewhat!
    If you're really set on your idea, I'd look at the top 15-20 or so on ntep.org, (tested in the midwest, of course) and have 4 of them blended into a custom mix for you by someone.
    I will personally stay of the opinion that they are meant to be 'nurse grasses' to other grasses in establishing new turf, and the 'play toy' seed of sports field folks, hydroseeders, municipalities, etc.
     
  5. Bandit 1

    Bandit 1 LawnSite Member
    Posts: 5

    perenial ryes do very well in columbus , we do not have a lot of brown patch issues in our area
     
  6. RigglePLC

    RigglePLC LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 12,343

    I agree with you Victor. Perennial rye has better seedling vigor and comes up fast if the soil is warm. And i agree that you should get a mixture of varieties from the NTEP top 10 or at least the top 20. Gray leaf spot is a concern in Ohio, I have heard. Red thread is a concern around here. I have seen some bad rust from time to time. The variety Derby Xtreme, is one of the best that comes to mind. But I would mix in a percentage of KBG, because your customers will expect it. And because you need the rhizomes to help the grass fill-in or creep when there is thinness or damage. Reduces disease pressure, too.
     
  7. Marcos

    Marcos LawnSite Gold Member
    Posts: 3,720

    Very good points.
    Lesco has a blend that is 75% (3 varieties) p. rye and 25% (usually 2 varieties) Ky. Bluegrass, called 'Eagle Blend + Blue'. If you take the fact that the actual size of an individual bluegrass seed is about 2/3 as big as that of rye, the bag is about half and half by seed count. I'd recommend calling over there (while Lesco people are still answering the phones! :laugh: ) to see what varieties are currently in that blend.
     
  8. turfsolutions

    turfsolutions LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 851

    Why not try TTTF on homes that don't water? Great hardy grass thats easy to maintain.
     
  9. rcreech

    rcreech Sponsor
    Male, from OHIO
    Posts: 6,072


    Victor,

    Don't take it personal! I am sure it is nothing you did. I did so much seeding this fall that I was actually getting sick of it!

    Some look good and some don't look so good. After we got the rain last week it changed big time...but there are some seedings that don't look to good. It all comes down to H2O.

    I use almost 100% Team Mates which is TTTF and Rye. Used about 12K this fall. GREAT SUCCESS with it!

    TTTF/RG in my opinion is one of the better mixes.
     
  10. NattyLawn

    NattyLawn LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,643

    I like the Trophy 95 TTTF/5 Blue on renovations and the Summer Stress 70 fescue/20 rye/10 blue from UAP on established lawns.
     

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