Strange Noise in Kohler CV15S reply from Kohler

Discussion in 'Lawn Mowing' started by Lynns, May 29, 2003.

  1. Lynns

    Lynns LawnSite Member
    Posts: 9

    This dialog is in chronological order, the last being first. This is
    in corresponding to Kohler about my engine. Interesting to say the least. So read from bottom to top.
    Reply From: Scott
    I don't suggest solid lifters as the cam is designed for hydraulics. The ramps of the cam are too aggressive for solid where the hydraulics will absorb and keep the lifters (and complete valve train) from bouncing as it goes over the top of the lobe. You will end up with tappet noise and short cam life.

    Scott Mack

    Reply to: Scott
    Hi Scott Mack:

    Thanks for your quick and informative response to my query.
    I was surprised when I read your second statement which you
    called a guess. My engine has had problems starting, sometimes
    the starter wasn't able to turn it over. I changed the battery this
    spring, and last week I had the starter cleaned and lubed.
    I just e-mailed the letter you sent to me to the John Deere dealer
    that I bought it from for an estimate on cost of repair. The repair
    would be replacement of the filters with solid, and replacement
    of the compression release, which based on your guess is very
    likely to be the problem.
    Thanks for your very educated guess, as I feel like you hit the
    nail on the head. It's always nice to communicate with someone
    who knows what they are talking about.
    Lynn Blakely "mower man now"

    ----- Original Message -----
    From: Scott Mack
    I asked a couple people in our department about your situation and the only occasional noise complaint we receive is from the lifters. This can usually be cured with new solid push rods. If the noise is from another source I suggest having a dealer look at it.

    One thing that comes to mind is if the compression release comes apart on the camshaft. If this is the case you will notice higher than normal compression at start up. The starter may have difficulty turning the engine over. This is my best guess.

    Scott Mack

    Subject: Kohler Engine
    Service Question
    Model Number: CV15S-41562
    Specification Number: <NA>
    Serial Number: 2917618031

    Comments: Something in the engine is making noise that is not normal. Engine in not idling properly, it wants to die or idle too slow. The valves seem to be working properly and we did remove the plug to be able to turn crankshaft by hand, it has good compression. Have you had any field reports of a problem with the fuel pump, or the oil pump? The engine is in my John Deere LT-155 mower, I purchased the mower on Feb 2-2000. The engine starts and runs but makes this bad noise. It is not the starter as we removed the plate over the gear that extends then retracts to disengage from the flywheel. I am waiting for your response. Lynn Blakely

    Time: 052103
  2. cos

    cos LawnSite Addict
    Posts: 1,253

    Take it back to the dealer!!!!
  3. Lynns

    Lynns LawnSite Member
    Posts: 9

    Yes I do plan on taking it back to the dealer. It is only 3 yrs. old.
  4. Richard Martin

    Richard Martin LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 14,700

    I just have one question if you contact the Kohler rep again.

    Just how is the upper part of the engine (rocker arms etc) supposed to get oil if you install solid pushrods? He is right in that solid pushrods probably would cure a lifter pumpup problem because then none of the oil would travel up the pushrods to the head. There is a kit made for older Kohler 25s that will cure a ticking lifter.

    Usually if the starter is having problems turning a Kohler twin over than the valves need to be adjusted. Yes I know they're hydraulic but they can still get out of adjustment and resetting them to factory specs can cure an apparent starter problem. It won't hurt to try setting the valves first because it's a whole lot cheaper than replacing internal engine parts that probably are fine anyway.
  5. Jman

    Jman LawnSite Member
    Posts: 217

    Richard, The valves are lubricated by oil mist or vapor. All of the command twin cylinders have had solid push rods since the early 90's. The solid push rod in the verticals keeps the lifters from bleeding down. When the lifters bleed down the compression release mechanism can't open the valves during the compression stroke. Also the valves are non-adjustable. They use a rocker arm similar to older fords that you tightened the rocker arm down solid. They do not use push rod guide plates because the rocker arms can not rotate. There is a "kit" to help eliminate valve train noise for the vertical shaft twins, but nothing for the single except the solid push rods.
  6. Wright Mfg

    Wright Mfg Guest
    Posts: 0

    If your engine oil is too thick, it won't pump up the lifters and then make a lot of noise. This has been the case with 22,23,25 Kohlers. They would make noise even with 10w40 but if you use the recommended SAE30 the noise would go away. Could be the same situation you're having.

  7. Lynns

    Lynns LawnSite Member
    Posts: 9

    FYI Here is the url to Kohler:
    This is the page I used to contact Kohler.
    Also notice there is an 800 number also.
    Note After "Scott" told me not to change to solid
    lifters, I have no intention of doing that.
    Thanks for all your input, I thought some of the
    members might like to know that Kohler does
    respond to inquiry's quickly.
  8. barnard

    barnard LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 618

    I had a problem with tis engine. One of the screws holding the carburetor on backed out and was sucked in the engine it was to large to pass the intake valve but was lodged between the valve and its seat. I removed the intake manifold to get at the screw and removed it . Engine runs again . No ill effects.
  9. barnard

    barnard LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 618

    IT was the screw holding the air cleaner base plate to the intake.
  10. Richard Martin

    Richard Martin LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 14,700

    That is good information to know Jman. Thank You! But, just one more question. Isn't the compression release only supposed to aid in starting the engine? And if that's the case then the lifters wouldn't even have had a chance to pump up yet would they? You're making it sound like the compression release works all of the time and if that's the case wouldn't it be simplier to just lower the compression thereby eliminating the need for the compression release?

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