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Well, it looks like I have to fire one

Discussion in 'General Industry Discussions' started by DFW Area Landscaper, Mar 6, 2006.

  1. oslo

    oslo LawnSite Member
    Posts: 54

    Do not follow the advice about deducting from his check. While you might get away with it, the penalties are stiff if he does catch this and file a greivance with the state. Chalk it up as a loss and be glad you caught him now.
  2. Paradise Landscapes

    Paradise Landscapes LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 960

    I was curious, I mean, When I was working for another LCO A long time ago, it was specified in the employee manual/policy that if we steal and/or are caught, break anything, it is deducted out of our pay leagally.
  3. SodKing

    SodKing LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,648

    This is NH state law....It doesn't look like you can withdraw $ from his check unless you and he have specifically signed a contract allowing you to do so...your state is probably similar...

    CHAPTER 275
    Payment of Wages
    Section 275:48
    275:48 Withholding of Wages. –
    I. No employer may withhold or divert any portion of an employee's wages unless:
    (a) The employer is required or empowered to do so by state or federal law.
    (b) The employer has a written authorization by the employee for deductions for a lawful purpose accruing to the benefit of the employee as provided in regulations issued by the commissioner or as provided in subparagraph (d).
    (c) The deductions are pursuant to any rules or regulations for medical, surgical, or hospital care or service, without financial benefit to the employer and openly, clearly, and in due course recorded in the employer's books.
    (d) Upon an employee's written request, an employer may deduct the following items from the employee's wages, provided that the employer shall provide a written itemized accounting of such requested deductions to the employee at least once per month:
    (1) Voluntary contributions into cafeteria plans or flexible benefit plans, or both, as authorized by section 125 or section 132 of the Internal Revenue Code.
    (2) Voluntary payments by the employee for the following:
    (A) Child care fees by a licensed child care provider.
    (B) Parking fees.
    (C) Pharmaceutical items, gift shop, and cafeteria items purchased on site of a hospital by hospital employees.
    (3) Voluntary installment payments of legitimate loans made by the employer to the employee as evidenced by a document that includes the following:
    (A) The time the payments will begin and end.
    (B) The amounts to be deducted.
    (C) A specific agreement regarding whether the employer is allowed to deduct any amount outstanding from final wages at the termination of employment.
    (4) Voluntary payments for the recovery of accidental overpayment of wages when the following conditions are met:
    (A) The recovery is agreed to in writing.
    (B) The deduction for the overpayment begins one pay period following the date the parties execute the written agreement.
    (C) The written agreement specifies:
    (i) The date the recovery of the overpayment will begin and end.
    (ii) The amount to be deducted, which shall be agreed upon by the employer and the employee but which shall, in no event, be more than 20 percent of the employee's gross pay in any pay period.
    (iii) A specific agreement regarding whether the employer is allowed to deduct any amount outstanding from final wages at the termination of employment.
    (5) Voluntary payments for the recovery of tuition for non-required educational costs paid by the employer for the employee to an educational institution when the specific deduction is authorized in writing prior to the deduction as evidenced by a document that includes the following:
    (A) The time the payments will begin and end.
    (B) The amounts to be deducted.
    (C) A specific agreement regarding whether the employer is allowed to deduct any amount outstanding from final wages at the termination of employment.
    (e) The employee requests in writing that deductions may be made for contributions to a political action committee from the employee's wages.
    (f) The employer has a written request from the employee, made at the time of the original request without coercion or pressure, that authorizes the employer to deduct from the employee's final wages at the termination of employment any amount the employee may owe for voluntary payments for vacation pay, paid time off pay, earned time pay, personal time pay, annual pay, sick pay, sick dependent pay, and bereavement pay made pursuant to a written employment policy as required by RSA 275:49, III, when the payments have been requested and paid to the employee in advance of eligibility.
    II. If an employer making a deduction of an employee's wages under paragraph I fails to make any payment relative to such deduction on the employee's behalf, and such employee loses any benefit or fails to meet an obligation caused by such failure, the employer shall be liable for such lost benefit or failed obligation. For any benefits provided to an employee paid for entirely by the employer without employee deductions, if the employer fails to make timely payments for such benefits and the employee loses any benefit or fails to meet any obligations caused by such failure, then the employer shall be liable for such lost benefits or failed obligations. The employer shall also be liable for any cost incurred by the employee caused by the employer's failure to make such payments.
    III. An insurer or plan administrator of a self-funded plan shall notify an employee in writing of termination of an employee benefit plan pursuant to the notification requirements of RSA 415:18, VII(g)(4) or the Employee Retirement Income Security Act, as applicable.
    IV. If a plan administrator fails to comply with the applicable employee notification requirements of the Employee Retirement Income Security Act, then the plan administrator shall be liable for lost benefits or failed obligations to the employee resulting from the termination of the employee's benefit plan. Such liability extends only for the period of noncompliance beginning on the date notification to the employee was required under the Employee Retirement Income Security Act and ending on the date proper notification was made. Such liability for plan administrators is secondary to the employer's liability during this period and becomes primary only after the department of labor determines that the employer is financially unable to pay all or any part of the employee's lost benefits and failed obligations. Such liability for plan administrators in no way diminishes the employer's liability during this or any period.
    V. For purposes of this section "plan administrator" means the fiduciary of the plan named in the adoption agreement who has the duties specified in the plan.

    Source. 1937, 149:1. RL 212:20. RSA 275:48. 1963, 237:3. 1994, 138:1, eff. Jan. 1, 1995. 2004, 145:2, eff. Jan. 1, 2005. 2005, 241:3, 4, eff. Jan. 1, 2006; 297:1, eff. Oct. 22, 2005.
  4. sheshovel

    sheshovel LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 5,112

    I don't know what to tell ya DWF.....besides assuming sometimes can make an azz out of you and me..you have no real proof..one secret shopper..you dident notice any on the doors..how bout knocking on a few other doors in that area just for the heck of it and ask them if the got a hanger on their door?
  5. Freddy_Kruger

    Freddy_Kruger LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,064

    1200 door hangers should take at least 10-15 hours to deliver. No?

    My Door Hangers I make myself and I do a word merge to pint out the addresses on them so they are in fact addressed mail. I hire to ppl and baby sit them the whole day giving them flyers at the start of each street or whatever. I put a lot of time in those damn flyers and want to make sure they are delivered but this is for window cleaning for lawn care (I'm just about to expand) I was going to put out a generic flyer, half page 20lb paper, is there a reason you put out door hangers for lawn care? Wouldn't it be easier to hire one of those companies that deliver ad bags?
    That's what I was thinking of but I'll say this, ppl respond a lot better when they see there address on a flyer.

    edit: no offense but my first thought would be that the flyers are thrown away, I would never trust anybody like that. If I tell them to put it in the mail box I tell them to leave a corner sticking out so I can easily locate them (the flyer guys) .
  6. work_it

    work_it LawnSite Senior Member
    Posts: 976

    Freddy, do not leave anything but registered U.S. Mail in a mailbox unless you want some huge fines. A mailbox is for mail only....not flyers.
  7. Freddy_Kruger

    Freddy_Kruger LawnSite Bronze Member
    Posts: 1,064

    ROFL, I'm Canadian, completely immune from the U.S Mail service. I make my guys put flyers even when they don't want any advertising "Save our Trees" etc..Got some of my best customers that way...
  8. oslo

    oslo LawnSite Member
    Posts: 54

    It is much the same in PA and NC that I know of, probably most states I would guess.

    Better just to give him whats owed, cut your losses and be done with him. On the off-chance that he has a brain and contacts the State, or that he is a psycho and takes his revenge out on your equipment, better just to avoid the potential headache altoghter.
  9. topsites

    topsites LawnSite Fanatic
    Posts: 21,653

    Nobody in their right mind wants to do door hangers. Door hangers are one of the lowest jobs on the face of this earth, possibly right next to suiting up as a monkey and prancing and dancing on a busy Interstate with a sign (yeah it sounds cool and funny and catchy until it's you standing out there).

    If you did that to me, I'd walk out on you... But maybe, just maybe I would take a chance and see if I could get paid for doing nothing, just because I already know my choices: Walk out, or take a chance and get fired (or maybe not, maybe I don't get caught - either way I'm out of a job, so why not take the chance).

    The math is simple.
  10. oslo

    oslo LawnSite Member
    Posts: 54

    At least in PA, the laws are really anti-employer on this issue.

    1. When an employee is fired, laid off, or quits, all monies owed must be paid by the next scheduled payday.

    In regards to deductions.

    1. An employee must give employers explicit written permission, at least 30 days in advance for any Non tax related deductions.

    2. It is not valid for an employer to have employees sign "blanket" authorization contracts at the time of hire to cover any future deductions..ie theft, destruction or non-returning of company property(although many employers do this)

    3. Furthermore, in cases when employees do give written permission for a deduction, the deduction must
    a. not reduce the employees gross pay to below minumum wage
    b. benefit the employee (ie. 401k, health benefits, employer loan, etc..)

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