Toro Stamped & Welded Decks

lbmd1 · Mar 2, 2003

Just want to clarify alot of misconceptions here on the board regarding Toro decks. So many times I hear " Toro 's are the same as Exmark except for their inferior stamped decks" "Don't buy Toro decks because they are stamped and are weaker" Like one of the members taglines says "better to remain silent and thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt" I don't claim to be an authority on Exmark, Scag, John Deere, etc.., so I don't chime in with my opinions because they would be without merit. Toro makes both welded AND stamped decks. Their 48" fixed decks are welded, their 62" SFS decks are welded and their 72" decks are welded. Those are a few that I am sure are welded. Many of the HP class Z riders and floating deck walk behinds are stamped. I also don't know what you guys do with your decks to abuse them so horribly or how long you keep them to stay away from other manufacturers besides Exmark because of their welded decks. We are on our 5th Zmaster and have never dented, creased, bent or abused these decks, nor have they rotted through. I just wanted to clear things up so when people or newbies ask about Toro mowers, they don't go out and not buy one because someone here says they are inferior because they have stamped decks. Remember, opinions are like a*#holes, everyone has one. Have a nice day.

Mike

HOMER · Mar 2, 2003

Never owned one but know a guy that has. He's replaced the deck on his already and it was stamped.

I think the longevity of a deck has a lot to do with your area. Our warm season grass for the most part is cut shorter than the cool season........that is based on what I read here. With our decks being closer to the ground by an inch to an inch and 1/2 we are also closer to the dirt. With high lift blades we can create one heck of a vacuum bringing sand and dirt into the chambers literally sandblasting them. Of course they aren't going to last as long doing this. One of my Chopper decks has a plate welded over a hole already and it's not stamped. Winter work down here is even worse on them because you really have to get the deck low to do cleanups and regular monthly visits. The grass gets pretty thin and 99% of your customers don't want to be overseeded with rye....which would really help the situation.

The thicker the deck the better round here.

brucec32 · Mar 3, 2003

I have owned 3 toros, 1 with welded and 2 with stamped decks. None have ever bent or cracked. I also think it should be made clear that these are heavy duty stamped steel, not lightweight like you'd find on a craftsman. I've done my share of banging them around with no problems.

Now if you have employees who abuse equipment, you might want to stick with heavier decks.

My 12.5hp Toro 36" driving two blades cuts heavy tall grass better than the 44" or 37" units did. But I wonder about some of the fine distinctions being made here about cut quality. Especially on tall cool season turf, which isn't as picky about how it's cut as short dense stuff like Bermuda.

1st Class Lawns · Mar 3, 2003

I have used Toro mowers since 1991 and have never had a problem with the decks at all. They are very dependable mowers.
I have also read post here concerning Toro decks not chopping up the clippings fine enough. Again, I don't have this problem. Maybe the ones that have this problem should remember the 1/3 rule.
I have just bought a new 52" WB Toro. When I need another mower it will be a Toro.
James
1st Class Lawn Service

CO.d 502nd · Mar 3, 2003

My problem with the stamped deck toro was this........................................................................the cut sucked

Lawn Specialties · Mar 3, 2003

I don't get what other guys are talking about either, never had any problems with mine or know anybody that has. Ive never gotten into any of these debates on here as I didn't sign up to get into the mine is better than yours arguments but I can say I love my equipment and my customers love the cut . I'm not planning on changing any thing.

BRIAN GALLO · Mar 3, 2003

Actually, nowadays the only stamped decks toro has are the 32 (single blade recycler model) 44 & 52's. The 36,62 and 72 floater decks are fabricated. All of their fixed decks 32,36 & 48 are actually Exmark metro's (right down to the flow control baffles) with a t-bar. I have 3 of the 44's and I think they cut great. Use what you like though?

1grnlwn · Mar 3, 2003

My opinion (I have many) of stamped decks is they have two limitations. 1. The thickness of metal that can be used. 2. The depth of the stamping (deck height). Thick tall decks seem to work best. Trying to stamp thick mat. in a deep draw is hard and leaves thin areas.

Mark

Envy Lawn Service · Mar 3, 2003

Here is what it realy boils down to. Decks can be stamped out of thick, hard heavy steel. Plus they can be stamped out deep and still remain very strong. They can also be stamped in such a way that would make them far superior to a fabricated deck, mulching, discharging, collecting ect under most all conditions.

The simple fact is that no MFG, less John Deere is willing to step up to the plate and buy the needed machinery to stamp such a deck, not when they can weld one up that will do a good job we'll easily accept. It takes 4 million pounds of pressure to stamp the 7-Iron deck. Then fabrication has to be done as well.

Now I can see the point of wearing holes in the thinner decks in some areas. You can do some serious sandblasting under there! But what you guys do to bend, dent or warp something like Toro's deck, I'll neve know. Do you launch it full speed into a stump? What?

My complaint with stamped decks is most are too dang shallow in the rear, the Toro deck included. But you can easily tell the Toro SFS deck is designed for fast side discharge.

1grnlwn · Mar 3, 2003

As a manufacturing engineer I am just saying that thick deep draws pose manufacturing and quality problems. There are lots of ways to compromise a deck. You throw the word "design" around a lot! Are you a designer? Any idea of the design process? Could you be a bit defensive about green equipment? Seems to me to name a deck (seven iron deck) is a creative marketing ploy to market a machine with an inferior deck. I have to agree with you on the other thread that those 3 mowers are all the same. Just paint difference.

Mark

turfcare · Mar 3, 2003

I have a 2003 62" Z-Master and love it. The SFS Deck will cut damp or wet grass without clogging. I have had no problems with grass clippings as I follow the one third rule.

Greener Side · Mar 3, 2003

Great topic I have been looking at both the Laser and the zmaster. A rep of Toro said they are the same mowers except for the decks. The SFS decks on the z200 series looked welded, but all the comments about them being stamped and weaker, confused me . Thanks for clearing this up

1grnlwn · Mar 3, 2003

Another observation on stamped decks. The bearing carrier area is typically dished. This provides strength since the metal is not of optimum thickness. This dished area is more likely to puddle water and cause rust. Definitely not a short term problem.

Mark

Envy Lawn Service · Mar 4, 2003

Originally posted by lbmd1
Toro makes both welded AND stamped decks. Their 48" fixed decks are welded, their 62" SFS decks are welded and their 72" decks are welded. Those are a few that I am sure are welded. Many of the HP class Z riders and floating deck walk behinds are stamped.

I also don't know what you guys do with your decks to abuse them so horribly or how long you keep them to stay away from other manufacturers besides Exmark because of their welded decks. We are on our 5th Zmaster and have never dented, creased, bent or abused these decks, nor have they rotted through.
Mike

Mike, I noticed the 62" I looked at had a welded deck on it. but it looked oddly built, especially on the trim side where it has that weird slope. What's that all about or for?

Also as you see from what I said before, I don't see how they punish them to the point of having problems. The most damage I have on any of my decks is a few scratches on the trim side.

Originally posted by 1grnlwn
As a manufacturing engineer I am just saying that thick deep draws pose manufacturing and quality problems. There are lots of ways to compromise a deck. You throw the word "design" around a lot! Are you a designer? Any idea of the design process? Could you be a bit defensive about green equipment? Seems to me to name a deck (seven iron deck) is a creative marketing ploy to market a machine with an inferior deck. I have to agree with you on the other thread that those 3 mowers are all the same. Just paint difference.

Mark

I throw the word design around a lot????

Well anyways, no I am not defensive about green equipment. Yeah I own one (not commercial) and honestly I'm 50/50 about it. How can I say this? It's quality built & strong but at the same time it is not designed (there I said it) very well overall. Now as far as the 7-Iron decks they put on the commercial stuff, I think they are pretty solid.

Originally posted by 1grnlwn
Another observation on stamped decks. The bearing carrier area is typically dished. This provides strength since the metal is not of optimum thickness.

Mark

QUOTE]Originally posted by turfcare
I have a 2003 62" Z-Master and love it. The SFS Deck will cut damp or wet grass without clogging. I have had no problems with grass clippings as I follow the one third rule. [/QUOTE

From the two previous staments I will add my 2 cents....

I think if deck parts were first stamped individually into shapes out of 7-10 guage and then welded together plus reinforced, then you would have one heck of a deck.

Mid Rivers · Mar 4, 2003

When the deck is deep drawn "stamped" I would have concerns of weakness in the corners. If I am correct the metal is going to stretch in those areas more than others.

With JD's extensive experience with sheetmetal I doubt they had much of an investment in machinery to make their 7 Iron decks. Just some tooling costs, becase I'm sure they have the presses large enough to punch they metal

Mark P · Mar 13, 2003

Im on my forth yr with a 62 Z-Master and am very pleased with it, the cut is great on the Toro Z, remember everyone has to sharpen blades on any Zs cut would look bad, i pressure wash mine all the time and my deck is in perfect shape, demo the exmark, and the Z-master i did and both cut great......Marks Mowing Service

Mark P · Mar 15, 2003

This is another test picture of Z-master,,,Marks Mowing Service

Mark P · Mar 15, 2003

Ill try one more time, Marks Mowing Service

grassdaddy · Mar 15, 2003

I work for the largest wrecker manufacter in world!There is only 1 reason for stamped parts-price!!I cannot believe ANYONE would believe a stamped dec could be superior to a good Fab.dec(LIKE EXMARK.HUSTLER AND SCAG).I'd say stamped cost about 1/3 the
price to produce.What does lgf have running across his screen?? so true!!

Flex-Deck · Mar 15, 2003

I am only a small town independent business guy that happened to patent a deck concept that is unique. I have done
1 all the cad work, and design engineering.
2 done all the marketing, and sales
3 weld the decks and get them painted
4 run jd with stamped decks, and my deck is fabricated.
they both seem to mow the same:

Visit my web site flex-deck.com and my sponsor forum on this site to see how to increase your profits, lower overhead etc.

One post said JD has no expense to stamp - Whoops - it probably costs about $1,000,000 for the forms to do a new deck design.
Yes, it is cheaper to stamp than fabricate - but only if you can sell about 10,000 or more decks per year.

I liked the post that stated - "What do you do to your decks to bend and destroy them - fabricated or stamped"

Stamped, Fabricated, whatever - they all do a job and have advantages and disadvantages.

Toro Stamped & Welded Decks

lbmd1

HOMER

brucec32

1st Class Lawns

CO.d 502nd

Lawn Specialties

BRIAN GALLO

1grnlwn

Envy Lawn Service

1grnlwn

turfcare

Greener Side

1grnlwn

Envy Lawn Service

Mid Rivers

Mark P

Mark P

Mark P

grassdaddy

Flex-Deck

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