I'm just starting landscaping this year and i was wondering how bad of an idea is it of just going and mowing lawns, no permits, no insurance, no registered business? What are the do's and don't of doing this? i'm 18 and in college is it worth getting all that for 20 lawns?
Under the table business
TheKingNJ
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I'm just starting landscaping this year and i was wondering how bad of an idea is it of just going and mowing lawns, no permits, no insurance, no registered business? What are the do's and don't of doing this? i'm 18 and in college is it worth getting all that for 20 lawns?
were I live you don't need permits. just insurance and pay taxes. I don't think your taxes would be very much for just 20 lawns. insurance would most likely be under $500 a year also.
It cost us $30 to register the fictitious name. This is basically a john doe is working under the name of The King Landscaping. We are also required to run a add in the legal section of the paper for 3 mondays in a row to let the public know. This cost us about $60.
Even if you need a permit, I don't think you have real reason not to start out right.
It cost us $30 to register the fictitious name. This is basically a john doe is working under the name of The King Landscaping. We are also required to run a add in the legal section of the paper for 3 mondays in a row to let the public know. This cost us about $60.
Even if you need a permit, I don't think you have real reason not to start out right.
i'll tell u what. if i were your age, had nothing to lose, and had the mind of a 19 year old, i wouldn't even think twice about it. i would operate a cash only business, not insured. the only way to get caught is if someone "rats" you out. and, who's gonna rat u out? 90% of guys cutting lawns do operate "under the table". as for me, at this point in my life, i like to be able to sleep at night. if i hurt someone, it's covered. my taxes are paid. quite a while back, i wrote a thread titled " are we only hurting ourselves". in it i explained that this is a very rough business to make a profitable one. the competition , and the law of supply and demand, being a great factor. the thing i could always count on is when 20 new guys pop up in the spring, 19 of them will be gone by the following spring. why? alot of reasons. and now, congradulations king and others like you. when 20 pop up every spring, only about 10 will be gone the following year. why? because lawn guys(and this is baffling to me) are very eager to share thier knowledge, and teach you everything you need to know, to become thier direct competition. king, can't you just get a job at like burger king or something, finish college, and go on to a miserable life working on somebody elses time clock? and along the way, keep your hands out of my pocket?
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Well said Bobby. At least I won't be the first to burst your bubble, but I really don't care to see guys like you in this business. Not only do you take food off my table and clothes off my daughters back, but you keep the overall public opinion of lawncare companies down. Another point to make is I'm the one who turns in guys like you; running a bootleg business. I don't mind turning bootleggers into the IRS. Did it last year when one came after my accounts. He's not in business anymore and really owes some back taxes. You may not be hurting my business personally, but you, and others like you, hurt our industry as a whole. Just stay out unless you are willing to take the proper steps to protect the industry, and it's customers.
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731 Posts
Well Said guys I dont think I could have said it better
i am like the last 3 or 4 posts , it pisses me off when people come in and dont run a legit biz and take out of my pocket . I run a by the books business and wouldnt think of doing it any other way . If i had to go under table doing business i would just get out, i cant afford to lose everything i have worked for all my life , and the way lawsuits are theses days if you threw a rock or golf ball and hurt someone or worse yet killed someone you can bet your sweet a$% they would have you for life. Thats why the days of the 20 buck mow and go are over for me . Its x amount to just drop the gate and then we go from there
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Man, if only i could catch the unlegit people around here. There are tons of them. I hate it, yea i dont tally everything that i make, probably only about 95% of what i make is on paper. The rest is friends and family that i dont really count. But i hate how so many people start up and then die off, i mean come on get a real job. It is a ruff and tuff world out there. A while back 2 lawn guys got in a fist fight over a lawn. Turns out the owner of the yard was tring to screw both of them.
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Hey All
Just think if all the legit biz quit being legit? With the equipment that most of us have and the experience we could compete at a price that would put all the others out of biz. If I did not have to play by the rules that kid down the rd. with the 21 in thats doing the neighbors lawn for $15 it takes him 1/2 hr. Pull in with a 60 inch, stripe it and do the other neighbors and you still have an extra 15 min . to do a couple more when your doing 4 to there 1 it kinda puts us on an even playing field. Why would anyone sue us? nothing would be in my or the co. name I would own NOTHING. so there would be no attorney that would even want a case that did not have ins. co. $$$ to go after. No taxes cash only so we could afford to keep some new equipment in some ones name. And the best part is if your not already established you could not get in we would be taking all the work since we already have the equip. Unless someone left you with a pile $$$$ to get started we could keep all the work and $$ to ourselves!
Mac
Just think if all the legit biz quit being legit? With the equipment that most of us have and the experience we could compete at a price that would put all the others out of biz. If I did not have to play by the rules that kid down the rd. with the 21 in thats doing the neighbors lawn for $15 it takes him 1/2 hr. Pull in with a 60 inch, stripe it and do the other neighbors and you still have an extra 15 min . to do a couple more when your doing 4 to there 1 it kinda puts us on an even playing field. Why would anyone sue us? nothing would be in my or the co. name I would own NOTHING. so there would be no attorney that would even want a case that did not have ins. co. $$$ to go after. No taxes cash only so we could afford to keep some new equipment in some ones name. And the best part is if your not already established you could not get in we would be taking all the work since we already have the equip. Unless someone left you with a pile $$$$ to get started we could keep all the work and $$ to ourselves!
Mac
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691 Posts
Do it right and get Insurance ! You will be glad you did if you ever get in a pickle! Besides everyone is sue happy! A million is not even close to enough if you do get sued! I am going to get registered as an LLC. Next Year.
One other thing, I am not sure about other states but here if you advertise or call yourself a Landscaper without a Landscape License you will get a huge fine and they will make you wait longer than they alreay do to take the test. It is long enough now !
Good Luck.
One other thing, I am not sure about other states but here if you advertise or call yourself a Landscaper without a Landscape License you will get a huge fine and they will make you wait longer than they alreay do to take the test. It is long enough now !
Good Luck.
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Man this thread really set some of you off, huh? Well I wouldn't do it.
Belive me there is plenty of people out there that do. Many people I know suggested that I do it until I have established a client base and got some income coming in but I didn't. I can't risk getting into an accident or hurting someone and being taken to court and possiblily losing everthing that I have worked so hard to get (new house, car, wife, etc, etc.)
Go the legal way its your best bet. Be better than the next guy with a mower out there. But that is just my opinion.
Do the right thing.
Belive me there is plenty of people out there that do. Many people I know suggested that I do it until I have established a client base and got some income coming in but I didn't. I can't risk getting into an accident or hurting someone and being taken to court and possiblily losing everthing that I have worked so hard to get (new house, car, wife, etc, etc.)
Go the legal way its your best bet. Be better than the next guy with a mower out there. But that is just my opinion.
Do the right thing.
Lets not forget that ThekingNJ come to us for advice. Lets not start giving him a hard time. Others will be afraid to ask for advice in the future.
TheKingNJ, Please take our advice and do it right. I had the feeling you just didn't know how to do it right. That is why I gave you examples of what I have to do in my neck of the woods and the cost. If you need help getting started email me at soupy@charter.net Ii will then give you my phone # and we can discuss what you will need to do to get started. One other thing I will suggest to you now just in case you shy away from contact me. Is go to Ebay and look for a copy of QuickBooks 2002. You can keep all records in this program and easily find an accountant that will be able to use a simple floppy disk with the files backed up to do your taxes. My accountant only charges me $110 and all I hand her is a floppy and she gives me a mountain of papers back.
Soupy
TheKingNJ, Please take our advice and do it right. I had the feeling you just didn't know how to do it right. That is why I gave you examples of what I have to do in my neck of the woods and the cost. If you need help getting started email me at soupy@charter.net Ii will then give you my phone # and we can discuss what you will need to do to get started. One other thing I will suggest to you now just in case you shy away from contact me. Is go to Ebay and look for a copy of QuickBooks 2002. You can keep all records in this program and easily find an accountant that will be able to use a simple floppy disk with the files backed up to do your taxes. My accountant only charges me $110 and all I hand her is a floppy and she gives me a mountain of papers back.
Soupy
Im with most of the guys..do it right, ya I hate giving money to other people too, but it is for your own protection. Ive been in this for about 10 years total....3 years to get through college....I then took a few years away with my other job, couldnt feed the family so I started up agian. Ive always done it part time and did it all under the table when in college, the second time around I got insurence and licences...it really dosent cost that much more (mow 22 lawns instead of 20) Ive never had a problem...but Its nice to know if I do Im covered. Good Luck
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Why don't you get a job delivering pizzas or something. What happens when you graduate, do you just tell your customers sorry- look for someone else, I'm outta here? The problem with college students mowing lawns for a few bucks is just that- a few bucks. They come in and lowball, most don't care how it looks, then they move and drop all of their customers.
LAWSUIT LAWSUIT LAWSUIT!!!!!!
get insurance at least.i think you may have a problem getting people to pay you cash and not a check.some feel funny about handing you cash.most are not going to write a check in your name.
in my state it is fine for you not to be registered or have a permit as long as your just cutting grass and raking leaves.
be careful and good luck
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Hmmm, just get a job delivering pizza? yeah lets see i have been working at a golf course for 4 years, busting my ass to make other people rich, eventually i started getting side jobs, weeding, edging flower beds, some lawns and i have learned how much more money i can make. Like hell i wanna work for minimum wadge. summer time i like working 65-70 hours a week, i like making my money. i'm going to community college now and i only go to school 2 days a week so i finally got the balls and the money to quit my golf course and start my own landscaping business. for all you people crying, i'm money out of your pocket, THAT IS BUSINESS. yes it is a cute little idea that everyone can be happy but we can't. I understand why i need to pay taxes and get insurance now and i don't blame anyone for turning people int cuz once angin THAT IS BUSINESS But you know what, this is the work that i love, i am staying at local instate colleges so i can continue working in landscaping though out college. And what happens when i graduate? I continue what i am doing part time and eventually i want to buy my own golf course and i can send my own crew out to mow my lawns. If i don't continue after college, i think people will be pleased with 4 years of loyal business. hmm I should work in a pizza place or ring up french fries. yeah its a cute idea, have time to hang out with my fiends but does that pay for college? no that gets me 125 a week. like hell i will ever work for minimum wadge to ever make someone else rich.
I know the effort that i need to do this, I know how to mow a lawn, I just need to learn the business aspect of it. and if i fail or some BS happens i will always gain the experence. i'm 19 i don't mess around, and why should i bend over to a pizza place so you have it easier?
I know the effort that i need to do this, I know how to mow a lawn, I just need to learn the business aspect of it. and if i fail or some BS happens i will always gain the experence. i'm 19 i don't mess around, and why should i bend over to a pizza place so you have it easier?
another good reason why i don't post much on this site.
RANT RANT RANT from the kids with the push mowers.
i think we all told you to do it the right way.when i was your age i was lucky.i worked for my family doing landscaping.now they don't wanna do it anymore and i took over.yeah we started out with 20 lawns but we were registered and had insurance even though it was a part time bizz.
don't come crying to us when a rock flys out from under your mower and hits a little kid in the eye and you have no insurance.i have lots of stories about things like that happening to guys with no insurance SON.
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