Lawn Care Forum banner
21 - 40 of 41 Posts
Discussion starter · #22 ·
I did get prodiamine at a low price. Well lower than what it is selling this year. So that is the reason I will be spraying prodamine
Would I have any issues spraying the 65WDG product out of my ZSpray at around 1/3/ac liquid volume rate? Do I need to upsize tips and/or nozzle screens vs. stock for this to work properly.
I'm not giving up on this idea yet as some of you guys do it, but I want to be sure I know everything involved so I don't clog up my machine and create problems that I would have if I simply flung pre+fert. Thx
 
What is 1/3 ac liquid volume rate mean?

I am at 18 gallons per acre rate (52 ounces per 1,000 sqft), no issues with TeeJet Floodjet GREY tips with screens removed at nozzles.

Only screen I use is a 50 mesh strainer at the bottom of the suction line in tank.


No issues at all.
 
Would I have any issues spraying the 65WDG product out of my ZSpray at around 1/3/ac liquid volume rate? Do I need to upsize tips and/or nozzle screens vs. stock for this to work properly.
I'm not giving up on this idea yet as some of you guys do it, but I want to be sure I know everything involved so I don't clog up my machine and create problems that I would have if I simply flung pre+fert. Thx
We've been spraying the 65wdg out of our Z-Sprays and SteelGreens for 8 or 9 years. Apply it with the 1/3gal (lavender) tips @ 40PSI @ 5MPH for an application rate of 1/3 gal per K. Experienced applicators run blue tips @ 40PSI @ 6MPH for and application rate of 1/3gal per K. We apply it at a rate of 1lb of prodiamine (.65lbs of active ingredient) per acre. We run the stock nozzle screens but do have larger main inline filters than the stock filters on the Z. The SteelGreen's come with a much larger inline filter than the Z's and we upgraded all of our Z's to this filter which really helps. The stock SG filter is about 3x the size as the stock Z filter so it goes about 3x as long before it needs cleaning. To measure the prodiamine 65wdg I use a regular chemical measuring cup and a food scale from Amazon that was about $15. Put the cup on the scale and hit the tare button to zero out the weight of the cup. Then pour in the prodiamine 65wdg until you reach your desired amount. Make a mark on the cup with a Sharpie at the the desired line and you don't need the scale anymore.
Image

I make up a cup for every employee. We do have machines with different liquid capacities so not every cup is the same. Cups are to be used only for measuring Prodiamine. Never put liquids in the cups or you can't use it for Prodiamine or the little granules will get stuck all over in the cup.

We do all mixing on site, our vehicle tanks only carry clean water. Our vehicles have 225gal tanks with a 5hp Honda paired with a D503 pump. We install a T fitting before the regulator that goes to a short quick fill line we use for filling our ride-ons. This setup moves water quickly. I can fill both tanks on my machine in just over 3 minutes. To mix the Prodiamine I start by shutting the valves off on the machine's boom, then back the regulator all the way off. This will get max agitation back into the machine. Next, select a tank to fill and make sure the valves for the other tank are off. Start filling the tank with water until you have a few gallons in it. While the tank is filling with water, start measuring out your prodiamine. By the time you have your prodiamine measured you should have a few gallons of water in your machine tank. Turn the machine's pump on. Then start to slowly pour in your prodiamine over about 15-20 seconds. Do not pour it all in at once, this is what I have found to cause clogging. Aim your fill hose to the point where the prodiamine is landing in the tank so it instantly gets a blast of water and won't stick to the tank bottom. Then add any other products you may need. Repeat the process for the other side. Then adjust you regulator back to where it needs to be, turn the boom levers back on and start spraying.

You will get occasional buildup on the filters but its not bad. I can normally go a week or two without needing to clean them and that is spraying 6 days a week for 10+ hours a day. There are some weeks where I do have to clean them a couple times in a week for some reason.

The product will settle out if it sits over night and settles out worse over the weekend. It's impractical to drain the tanks every night and it's impossible to have it work out perfectly to have enough mix to get your last stop done without having some leftover mix in the tank. The material will go back into suspension quite easily. In the morning start the machine and shut the boom levers off. Then back the regulator all the way off and turn the pump on for a few minutes per tank to help get the prodiamine back into suspension. Hop on the machine and use the hydraulics to rock the machine back and forth 5-10 times. This will really slosh the tanks around and gets the prodiamine back into suspension. The only time this can be a problem is if your tank is completely full with no airspace for the water to slosh around in.

If on a Z-Spray one mod I highly suggest doing is adding an elbow to the return line in the bottom of the tank. This will allow you to point the flow from the return line to the bottom of the tank. This will really help with getting the prodiamine back into suspension. Some of our SteelGreens came from the factory with the elbow already installed and it really helps with this.
Image


In our experience spraying prodiamine has gotten us much better results than spreading it on fert. It also much better at preventing CG than any form of dimension. The other bonus is that its also a lot cheaper than buying it coated on fert and you can use a much better fertilizer than the typical garbage analysis products they coat with prodiamine. No more hustling 30-50 bags a day of 13-0-0. Plus your fert is now free of pre-emergent. You show up to Mrs. Smith's house and find out she seeded her back yard. Just sling your clean granular product across it and don't run your sprayers in back. No more scooping out the hopper or going to get the push spreader. Have a lawn that has a history of bad crabgrass or where the customer scalps it and never waters it? You can mix the prodiamine a little heaver or just up your psi or slow down your mph.

On prodiamine 65wdg vs prodiamine 4l, we haven't noticed one working better than the other. We have noticed on is cheaper than the other. A 5lb jug of 65wdg is up to about $95 from $55 in Dec of 2021. The 5lb jug contains 3.25lbs of AI. Prodiamine 4l is now about $340 for a 2.5gal jug. It has 4lbs of prodiamine per gallon for a total of 10lbs of prodiamine in the 2.5 jug. At 1lb/acre the wdg costs $19 per acre. For 1lb/acre the 4L costs $21.90 per acre.
 
Discussion starter · #25 ·
Hey that is some great detailed info, thx! Regarding your inline filter, your speaking of the barrel filter in the twist off cap, right? Would the SG one fit in a Z? I agree the Z filter is pretty fine mesh.
 
Hey that is some great detailed info, thx! Regarding your inline filter, your speaking of the barrel filter in the twist off cap, right? Would the SG one fit in a Z? I agree the Z filter is pretty fine mesh.
The SG filter fits on the Z just fine. The picture below is one of our old Z's with the SG filter mounted to it. I'm holding the original Z filter next to it for comparison.
Image


Below you can see the SG filter is about twice as long as the original Z filter. They are both the same #50 mesh size. The SG one is twice as long so you have twice as much surface area to use before it starts to restrict flow.

Image


Below you can see the SG filter is also a larger diameter. Being that its about twice as long and its bigger around you actually have close to 3 times the surface area. This allows to filter to go about 3 times as long before it needs any cleaning.

Image


Also a correction from my previous reply. I just looked at pricing from our supplier and our Prodiamine 65WDG is actually $78.50 per 5lb container. This brings the price to apply it at 1lb per acre down to $15.70 per acre.
 
Ok. Will prob just get a looser mesh filter that fits the Z plumbing then, if one exists. Don't really want to take everything apart for a new ftting.
The entire filter assembly is under $30. One end of the filter is a hose clamp and the other end is a threaded elbow. It just took me less than 3 minutes to take it off the machine.

Link to the larger filter assembly. TEEJET 3/4" 126 SERIES LINE STRAINER W/ 50 MESH

Start by l loosening the hose clamp
Image


Then push remove the rubber line off the barbed hose fitting.
Image


Then spin the filter housing off of the tank selection valve assembly.
Image

Its that easy to remove the filter assembly. As I said it didn't even take me 3 minutes. Once you get the old filter housing off just swap over the hose barb fitting and threaded elbow onto the new filter housing making sure to follow the arrows for which way to mount it for proper flow. Make sure to use thread tape or thread paste on the threads. You will have to cut a couple inches off of the rubber hose that goes behind the hopper as the new filter assembly is a lot bigger. Then thread the elbow into the tank selection assembly until its tight. Lastly, install the rubber hose onto the barb fitting and tighten the hose clamp. If you have the filter assembly, tools and thread tape or paste, its less than a 10 minute job from start to finish.
 
We've been spraying the 65wdg out of our Z-Sprays and SteelGreens for 8 or 9 years. Apply it with the 1/3gal (lavender) tips @ 40PSI @ 5MPH for an application rate of 1/3 gal per K. Experienced applicators run blue tips @ 40PSI @ 6MPH for and application rate of 1/3gal per K. We apply it at a rate of 1lb of prodiamine (.65lbs of active ingredient) per acre. We run the stock nozzle screens but do have larger main inline filters than the stock filters on the Z. The SteelGreen's come with a much larger inline filter than the Z's and we upgraded all of our Z's to this filter which really helps. The stock SG filter is about 3x the size as the stock Z filter so it goes about 3x as long before it needs cleaning. To measure the prodiamine 65wdg I use a regular chemical measuring cup and a food scale from Amazon that was about $15. Put the cup on the scale and hit the tare button to zero out the weight of the cup. Then pour in the prodiamine 65wdg until you reach your desired amount. Make a mark on the cup with a Sharpie at the the desired line and you don't need the scale anymore.
View attachment 532183
I make up a cup for every employee. We do have machines with different liquid capacities so not every cup is the same. Cups are to be used only for measuring Prodiamine. Never put liquids in the cups or you can't use it for Prodiamine or the little granules will get stuck all over in the cup.

We do all mixing on site, our vehicle tanks only carry clean water. Our vehicles have 225gal tanks with a 5hp Honda paired with a D503 pump. We install a T fitting before the regulator that goes to a short quick fill line we use for filling our ridmoves water quickly. I can fill both tanks on my machine in just over 3 minutes. To mix the Prodiamine I start by shutting the valves off on the machine's boom, then back the regulator all the way off. This will get max agitation back into the machine. Next, select a tank to fill and make sure the valves for the other tank are off. Start filling the tank with water until you have a few gallons in it. While the tank is filling with water, start measuring out your prodiamine. By the time you have your prodiamine measured you should have a few gallons of water in your machine tank. Turn the machine's pump on. Then start to slowly pour in your prodiamine over about 15-20 seconds. Do not pour it all in at once, this is what I have found to cause clogging. Aim your fill hose to the point where the prodiamine is landing in the tank so it instantly gets a blast of water and won't stick to the tank bottom. Then add any other products you may need. Repeat the process for the other side. Then adjust you regulator back to where it needs to be, turn the boom levers back on and start spraying.

You will get occasional buildup on the filters but its not bad. I can normally go a week or two without needing to clean them and that is spraying 6 days a week for 10+ hours a day. There are some weeks where I do have to clean them a couple times in a week for some reason.

The product will settle out if it sits over night and settles out worse over the weekend. It's impractical to drain the tanks every night and it's impossible to have it work out perfectly to have enough mix to get your last stop done without having some leftover mix in the tank. The material will go back into suspension quite easily. In the morning start the machine and shut the boom levers off. Then back the regulator all the way off and turn the pump on for a few minutes per tank to help get the prodiamine back into suspension. Hop on the machine and use the hydraulics to rock the machine back and forth 5-10 times. This will really slosh the tanks around and gets the prodiamine back into suspension. The only time this can be a problem is if your tank is completely full with no airspace for the water to slosh around in.

If on a Z-Spray one mod I highly suggest doing is adding an elbow to 65wdg is up to about $95 from $55 in Dec of 2021.
I quit using the WDG years ago because Turfco told us it would destroy the diaphragm in the pump. It is most definitely a cheaper option I’ll have to revisit. Thanks. Also the SG screen would be a big improvement over the Z screen, a lot of the humic I run has particulates that will clog the z screen more than once during a tank. I appreciate the info.
 
I’m running the lowly but to me much appreciated permagreen at quart per k using 4L and have had no issue. I mix as needed and add a little straight water end of day at last round before heading back and so far zero issues 3 years in. Clean screens 2 times a year.
 
Discussion starter · #33 ·
Should you go to a 30 mesh screen when spraying pre instead of the std 50 mesh? Seems the fine screen would plug up fast. Speaking of both the inline screen and the tip screens.
 
I quit using the WDG years ago because Turfco told us it would destroy the diaphragm in the pump. It is most definitely a cheaper option I’ll have to revisit. Thanks. Also the SG screen would be a big improvement over the Z screen, a lot of the humic I run has particulates that will clog the z screen more than once during a tank. I appreciate the info.
Every manufacturer says that everything will destroy their pumps. Whether its liquid fertilizer, iron, humics, micro mixes, wettable powder fungicides, quinclorac df, Prodiamine 65wdg, etc. I'm sure these products can have an effect on the lifespan of the pumps but we didn't have a noticeable difference in pump life from before spraying 65WDG and after. In the grand scheme of things, pumps are cheap, and if it reduces pump life by 25% or so its no big deal, its a 5 minute swap. Prodiamine 65WDG definitely stays in suspension better than Prodiamine 4L. When we decided to switch from spreading to spraying Prodiamine, our regional Syngenta rep suggested the 65WDG over the 4L due to it staying in suspension better.
 
Yep, on the Z it’s a 5 minute swap. On the Turfco it’s more like a 5 hour ordeal. I’ve just had that mindset for years now, the WDG is much more portable, cheaper . Etc. The 4L was a nightmare in the Turfco, but not in the Z. Again thanks !
 
I regularly spray 4L at 21-24 oz per acre along
With other herbicides. A lot less issues than the wdg. I don’t get any clogging. It does settle if left overnight but that’s a given with any prodiamine formulation.

my nurse and sprayer tanks are so much cleaner with the 4L
 
21 - 40 of 41 Posts