Jim thanks for all the nice compliments I think the main point of my post is that the drop off directly off the patio is not safe, especially if its a steep slope like you made it clear. If you had to build the wall like that I would of sold them a seat wall or a railing of some kind. I do not think anyone can look at those pics and tell me its a safe patio with that drop off!!! Sometimes you need to tell the client they have a bad idea! Notice I did not bash your craftsmanship at all.