Calculating N rates on iron products

Discussion in 'Fertilizer Application' started by ArTurf, Oct 8, 2012.

  1. Think Green

    Think Green LawnSite Silver Member
    Messages: 2,746

    I am still around thank goodness after being exposed numerous times to Chlordane, Lindane, Chlorpyrifos, and nicotine sulfates.
    There is a more in depth reason besides a herbicide like MSMA that controls pretty much foliar burning to eliminate a weed through starvation.
    You, Skipster, Ric all have good points as to the removal of older herbicides as a scientific stard, but I feel that my responses is a little basic but the fact still stands.
    There has been thousands of products removed from the market for reasons of toxicity...yet it is still sold, used and imported back to us from foreign markets that has no strict standards.
    The US Customs Dept. can't catch them all, especially those products that slips into our seaboards.
    I do not; for a second feel that all loss is from improper management and application of these products. If the same formulation is made for the general consumer) no wonder it is under fire from the industry. There is more products flushed down toilets, into ditches, waterways than one can imagine. (It is not from the Professional). It very well may be resistance that springs to mind first.!!
    I have read that, once a product becomes the cure all in the industry standard, it becomes infiltrated and saturated into deep cracks. The product is like any product.......once the saturation is completed, it isn't a necessary money maker and must be removed. So, the only legal way to remove a standard use product is to scheme a Medical condition as a result of and have it sent to the RUP sector. From there it is subjected to review and a lot of paperwork.
    Since all States do not mandate strict management of herbicide, insecticide uses to be documented, it is impossible to distinguish negligent uses. All the industry can do is trace all containers purchased. They cannot trace who, what, where, when and why!!!
    This is just how I feel!!!!!
    I know this has nothing to do with calculating the N content of Iron liquid so sorry for highjacking this thread.
    So if products is mismanaged.......lets not blame the industry, it is those that represent the industry. Like I said--" If the materials are not forced on the exams, then who is really to blame?" I am for not going beyond the bun in education......but that is because I dont use liquid fers much. The other is the industry leaders of each state for not being responsible themselves for higher learning.
  2. phillie

    phillie LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 861

    I also agree. I think the EPA regulates us further than golf courses and sod farms is because we are treating other peoples lawns. Sod farms and golf courses are treating their property. We are also carrying these products on our trucks on a regular basis making for a higher risk of contaminating the environment. I dont believe it's because the EPA thinks we are ignorant by any means.
  3. Ric

    Ric LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,969

    I don't think, I KNOW the EPA regulates Horticulture heaver than Ag or Golf Courses. READ THE LABEL They are under Ag regulations and we aren't. They still have a list Chemicals that were ban to us. Dursban (Lorsban) is just one that everyone should understand.

  4. Ric

    Ric LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,969

    Oops Sorry I left out two very key words in my above post.


    BTW It is HUGE.
  5. Skipster

    Skipster LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,086

    I don't see EPA regulating LCOs any more than it does golf courses or sod farms. But, there are many more acres of lawns than golf or sod and there are more LCOs than golf courses or sod farms. Although fines to golf courses are typically larger than to LCOs, there are way more LCOs with violations than golf courses.

    The bottom line is that the regulators think they can trust the golf and sod guys more than LCOs because golf and sod producers are typically more educated (I know -- not always, but typically) and the barriers to entry are higher in those industries. All it takes to be an LCO is a truck, spreader, and sprayer.

    If we demonstrate that we are interested in education and that we follow labels and regulations correctly, maybe the regulations will lighten up.

    Did it ever occur to anyone why MSMA is not banned for golf and sod use, but it is for LCOs, even though the main risk (and reason for re-registration denial) was a golf application? The regulators think they can trust the college educated golf course superintendent more than the hillbilly-in-a-truck LCO.

    Not passing a judgement on anyone -- that's just what they think and I think we can change that, but it's goign to take a concerted effort.
  6. turfmd101

    turfmd101 LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,376

    Golf courses get to keep products because the higher the turf quality. The higher the golf traffic which generate lots of tax $ for the state. Golf is tax $. Important state revenue. They can keep good products to keep quality high to get rounds of golf played and making $.

    Turf applicators generate no state $. There apps don't count as much. In Fl anyway.
    Posted via Mobile Device
  7. clemsonturf

    clemsonturf LawnSite Member
    from SC
    Messages: 109

    I disagree. It's got more to do with reducing home site exposure and economics.

    The arsenical committee saw the light and realized they were going to wreck the sod business, in turn, wrecking local economies. It would have been a big set of dominoes the economy wouldn't have been able to handle.
  8. cgaengineer

    cgaengineer LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 15,778

    You my friend are a broken record.
    Posted via Mobile Device
  9. My 2 cents

    The golf course supt are much more educated and spend alot more time continuing their education.

    What % of lco operators have a 4yr ( bs degree) in horticulture or a turf degree? Wonder what % of gc supt have one?

    Now I know their are plenty of very well educated lco operators, but just review all the thousand of dumb question....and thank you all for learning on this site............and you know I'm right
  10. Ric

    Ric LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,969


    Big Difference in the Money per sq ft spend on Golf Course Turf and Home owner turf. BTW LS is like all forums. You must wade thur a ton of BS to find a grain of knowledge.


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