lawnmwrma

LawnSite Member
Hello-
New to the site and thought to start with the simpler of two questions that have caused me to come looking for model specific assistance. Depending on this machine to meet workload- any assistance is greatly appreciated, especially considering how daft these questions will appear. I appreciate those who belong here, what you do and anything you Lawn Gods [ and Goddesses? ] can suggest. I have spent hrs on the phone w both CC/MTD and Kohler. I have called 6ya, watched innumerable YT videos... asked the gusy at NAPA, L's, read the owner's and svc manuals (although, wiring diagrams not a specialty of mine)

Not one person who spoke with me could tell me what the small green ground wire clamped to the main ground at the ground to frame connection is.

Cub Cadet LT-1050
Mod 13RP11CP756

Kohler Courage Twin V [SV720]

This machine was in 10 year old minty condition last fall when it was put to bed- all new belts, new plugs, no rust, 98% cosmetic condition, 100% working order= started fast, ran strong. garage kept since initial purchase, cleaned regularly, steering bushings replaced twice, other than that just reg rep belts, fluids, batts bulbs blades. Yes, it's a Cub Cadet, yes, it's old, but so am I and I still run...ok; nix that: reliably and strong. It's performed like a dray horse and been treated like a beloved pet though used much harder. Never before has this happened here= dar, 1st time for everything.

It appears the operative term for this situation began with what now seems to be universally described as 'Mouse Condo.' Said M. chose last winter to inhabit the top right [right when facing machine, not on it] portion of the engine block under the housing, apparently intermittently snacking on the plug wire to the left ignition module as well as the single spade connected wire that feeds the coil and another wire that travels with the continuation of that feeder towards the rear of the engine.

Without prior knowledge of winter tenant, initially attempting to start resulted in noticing one headlamp was out and she wouldn't catch. Too wise/cautious to overstay welcome turning key = try it... wait.. patience is a virtue, pay attention to symptoms.. foot on brake again, turning key second time =ed small puffs of smoke (which supposedly powers machines with Lucas, Prince of Darkness systems) but now, along with the telltale ZZZpht sound and lighting associated with sparks.

This try and wait timing sounds: strong, like unga unga unga [click and clack sound fx, there] not catching, i stop there, pause 10 seconds, try again. Two times total over two days = 4 attempted starts. I do not turn the key and hold it there expecting a miracle. Aiming for moderation here, not to b it to the g.

Turned key off, immed disconnected battery. Investigated, finding one melted green [14 or 16 gauge? ground wire] which is metal bound directly to where it joins the main ground at the main ground to frame connxn which melted and shucked its casing again later in the lower portion of harness located below battery tray. The 2nd bit of melted ground stopped melting just before it was on its way into corrugated sheathing heading through floorpan [ahead of firewall] but headed towards rear of machine. Glad to have turned it off. Looks to be either 14 or 16 gauge ground. Replaced it with 12 that was handy, butt jointed and heat shrunk connections. Further recon revealed M. Condo, munched coil wire and previously described, adj 16g wiring, since repaired. Nice to have lady hands. Happy to trade with anyone who can open a jar without a 1940s geared wooden handled kitchen tool.

After much time spent looking for the original ignition coil CC specs: KH-20-584-01-S, found an online seller who stated KH-20-584-03-S is replacement. Received coil, repaired red and white wires, installed and gapped coil (.011-.013) and having thorrroughly cleaned engine and done best to check all other wiring and connections, attempted to start her up, no dice. 1st time=Turns over, Will not catch.

After 3rd of 4th key tried to date, (after cleaning bulb connxns and seeing that they worked on try 3.. i Idiotically? Noticed hour/batt gauge reading 11.8 which caused action of removal of headlamp bulbs before reattempting key. 4th attempt = sparks at frame below [same] right plug. Disconnected battery. Closed hood. Drove to NAPA, bought new [U1 300CCA] battery, nice NAPA guy tried to sell me 4 gauge wires, drove to L and bought the 6s CC specs instead. So, bought new cables , and enough 16G wire to recreate headlamp harness, if needed. Returned to immobile machine, removed main ground to frame, removed paint from frame, reconnected ground, closed hood exited mosquito hour for interior contemplation. No one I can find online has described this in any way that will allow me to repair it.

Q1: Is KH-20-584-03-S the correct ignition module?
[installed it as it came off, single to which connection is made is down, unused double up top.]

Q2: Where are any other grounds I can check? Have cleaned and visually scrutinized all other M. Condo adj wiring, which looks to be in perfect condition. Wow. maybe I should be doing this at night, to look for arcing.

Q3: Having looked everywhere I could think for anything skint or nicked, any other suggestions where to look for ground faults or troubled wiring that could be causing a drain and or short. Oh, also loosened and tightened starter connxn (at bottom)

Still could be ...in the starter solenoid or some other component not working. Has oil, will have new plugs, wires and batt in tomorrow. Have not yet loosened and tightened motor mounts. Trying to get my head around how to do that w/o removing the deck, which may happen tomorrow. Done it before, will do it again.

So far, the worst thing that's happened is having lost a half-paper towel under the rear of the engine, Lawn Gods/esses Don't let me forget that is in that crevice!

This 54 yr old house/yard wife bows in your general direction.
I cut 7 acres every 9 days - not the thousands you here cut, but I and elderly neighbors I help for fun rely on this machine. Lost the best of them last year, a 93 yr old retired airplane mechanic who taught me modern engine tips and tricks, even I as a female who's rebuilt 2 302v8s didn't know. Bring your inner boy/g scout? Many many thanks.
 

Breezmeister

LawnSite Gold Member
Location
South Jersey
Alot of writing there.....I doubt that most of the guys here will read all of it, they don't even RTFM

If I read that all right, your starter does work....I have the attention span of Dory and get distracked very easily

Anyway, I would make sure there is spark, here is a link on how to check for it.


And, does your machine have a gas valve to shut the fuel off...is it open ? You would be surprised how many people forget about that..........
 
OP
L

lawnmwrma

LawnSite Member
Yes,
Alot of writing there.”

Sorry about the volume of information, just trying to tack down what was already done, like the man asks, in the 'read this before posting," notice.

But, thank you, kind Sir, for your gallant response.

No, this machine does not have a gas valve to shut the fuel off.
I know brand new freshly gapped plugs do not equal proof of spark.

Since posting, I’ve:
replaced the fuel pump and filter, removed and completely cleaned the carb (so now DO have CLICK evidencing solenoid on carb is working when key is turned:yea.)

cked main line from tank and have feed,
cked all other lines for obstruction and found none,

removed, cleaned and reinstalled the solenoid..
but now am getting a different sound instead of the unga unga when keyed- instead, it’s a moan and only a coupla times did it try to even turn over.

so thursday will install new solenoid. now i’m guessing if that is bad it may be why i’ve seen no gas in new (clear) filter- as apparently too little juice will stop gas from being sent where it needs to go.

also.. even though starter was initially engaging, but because engine did not catch, bendix? remained up in flywheel, so - because i didn’t know that, then and thouht it was 'stuck'-- guess what? i cleaned it, too.

it was pretty gummy and rides free-er now.. but at this point i’m avoiding replacing the whole starter, so i may need to take it off, dismantle and clean it completely.

my current q’s are:

could replacing 3 runs of previously mouse chawed 16guage grounds with 12 be causing any battery drain problems?

why does the 2nd of two batteries purchased read 11.3 to .8 (no worries, the first was a piecebofjunk from WallyWorld ‘someone else bought’) but even the biggest —300CCA bat from NAPA is reading that low on dash guage- so... what’s draining it?!

i do know that answer won’t come from RT*M (thoroughly perused and found wanting in simple details I need) and that I have to find the answer myself, but even calling CC and Kohler produced no answer as to where there is any other inline fuse, inline stator, or what that 16gauge ground coupled with the main ground to frame is.

Just the same, thank you, sincerely for being knightly and !!!responding!!! I’ll go look at your video now, although I have an aversion to sparks.
 
Last edited:
OP
L

lawnmwrma

LawnSite Member
heehee (4:10- "it is normal not to not see a spark when the engine is not turning over")


well..other than with a tester, i will see no spark: seat must be sat in to start engine. yes, right- cinder block, but that will not turn the key, and because engine will not catch.. well.. that's why so far i'm better at restoring carb than finding spark. need to find a intro to multitester, voltmeter, test light or a local volunteer. iso retiree who likes pumpkin bread, apple pie... single malt...


"suburban mosquitoes used to be a test of patience
now they're an actual danger to life and limb"
 

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