Lawn Care Forum banner

customer owes money

6K views 42 replies 23 participants last post by  Scottscape 
#1 ·
what can you do when a customer owes you money for 2 months of
lawncare? I approached him about it after i finally caught up with him,
and he ordered me off his property. any suggestions would help.
 
#2 ·
Like i told my brother, if anyone ever tried to not pay me for services, I would dump what i thought were a proper amount of clippings on their front lawn. Let them deal with the mess. you dont pay, HERES YOUR F'ING GRASS BACK! :angry: :realmad:
Now i know thats not good advice but thats how i would handle the situation :cool2:
 
#4 ·
CURB APPEAL NC said:
I cant see how you guys go two months without being paid! After the first month or after the second cut in my case NO MONEY NO SEVICE you dig?
A lot of us invoice monthly after the work is completed. Then we give them a month to pay. This puts a non payer at 2 months.

I invoice on the 1st of each month for the previous month and give a 15net pay but even a good percentage of customers still pay around the 20th or so(I believe that is because they get paid around the 15th). So I go ahead and let people have the full 30 days to pay. I always get burned by a couple each year, but if I was strict and held to the payment by the 15th I would piss off a lot of otherwise good customers. Even if they don't pay by the 15th and we cut them off they still owe for 1 1/2 months.

It's part of being in business and like any business you have losses. I can see were a guy cutting grass would want to be paid after each cut, but most lawn care companies invoice their customers.
 
#5 ·
I guess it depends on the type of cust. As a rookie (1st season) I Have a lot of lower end accounts and customers. Next year I am going to try and improve my quality of customers and will probably start a billing schedule. For now I just get paid every other cut either in my hand or mailed to me. If I dont have the money before or by my second visit NO SERVICE. I would love to be able to just cut and not worry about the money and just open the mailbox but like I said my customer based is used to the kid down the street mowiing for $20. They dont likem the idea of getting another bill. Something in there mind set! Eveny though technically its still a bill evey month if I bill them OR they put ti in my hand. Dont tell them that! Hopefully by next year there will be some level of trust and can start billing 30 days.
 
#6 ·
You can said him a Legal notice that you are going to collections and try to scare him.Thats usually all it takes for me.Or you can go the other route put some round up in a squirt gun and write a nice letter on his lawn. Or just put DEAD BEAT NON PAYER so everyone can see ;)
 
#7 ·
In Illinois you can file a mechanics lien against the property, but you have to do it with 6 weeks of the due date for it to be valid. In Illinois the forms are available from the county clerk's office, all you do is fill them out, with the tax parcel number of the property you are filing a lien against, return them with the fee paid ($18) and the County Recorders office sends them back with book and page as proof of filing. You can add in a fee for the trouble you have gone to also. Then you can send a letter to customer, copy of lien attached, and let them know they can have it removed for the cost of mowing, fee for filing and your fee for time and trouble, and the fee to file a release. If they don't pay the lien stays until property is sold, and then you get your money. Mean time they have a blot on their credit. Last one I did was for a one time cutting, for $100. She wouldn't pay, filed lien for $250 for $100 dollar job, and she had to pay $250 plus another $18 for filing release.
Do a google search for Mechanics Lien for your state, you should be able to find the statute, read thru it, (all legalese), or see an attorney for a explanation of ins and outs for your state, and then do the rest on your own, each and every time it happens. Good luck, and this is not legal advice and I'm not an attorney who cuts grass.
 
#8 ·
you guys will never learn. billing after the fact, and allowing 30 days to pay, while at the same time recieving more of your service, and running up additional bills, is not "part of business", it's plain rediculous. now you are issuing lines of credit to these people. what do you know about issuing credit? have you been trained in all the ins and outs of the credit laws in your state? have you been trained in how to deal with non payers, how to speak to them, how to handle them, etc? did you run a credit check before allowing a line of credit? the answer to these questions are NO, NO, AND NO. if you know nothing about electricity, you don't mess with electrical wires, do you? well, you are not a credit company, so don't issue credit. when i started, i issued credit, it didn't take me long to realize that if you don't like to get burned, you don't put your hand in the fire
 
#9 ·
This is an interesting law:

Theft of services
Theft of services is the legal term for a crime which is committed when a person obtains services - as opposed to goods - without lawfully compensating the provider of said services.

Crimes of this sort are typically prosecuted as Quick Facts about: larceny
The act of taking something from someone unlawfullylarceny, and may be either a Quick Facts about: misdemeanor
A crime less serious than a felonymisdemeanor or a Quick Facts about: felony
A serious crime (such as murder or arson)felony, based upon the value of the services illegally obtained. Specific examples of statutes covering these matters include Section 165.15 of the New York State Penal Law and Section 502 of the California Penal Code (in the latter state the main section dealing with Quick Facts about: theft
The act of taking something from someone unlawfullytheft, Section 484, may also be applicable depending on the precise circumstances of the case).

This category encompasses a wide variety of criminal activity - including, but not limited to, tampering with an electric or gas meter so that the true level of consumption is understated; leaving a restaurant or similar establishment without paying for the meal; and "turnstile jumping" or other methods of evading the payment of a fare when using a public transit vehicle.

These statutes have also, on occasion, been applied in the realm of Quick Facts about: health care
Social insurance for the ill and injuredhealth care, when hospitals or other health-care providers have pressed criminal charges against indigent, uninsured patients who were unable to pay for their treatment. One such instance was reported in the February 19, 2004 edition of the Wall Street Journal, involving two hospitals in the Quick Facts about: Champaign-Urbana, Illinois
 
#11 ·
grasscatcher10 said:
what can you do when a customer owes you money for 2 months of
lawncare? I approached him about it after i finally caught up with him,
and he ordered me off his property. any suggestions would help.
Give us some more info.....

How do you bill?
Why did he order you off his property?
Did you send him late notices in writing?
What proof do you have that he owes you money(i.e. signed contract, written bills, etc.)?

I'm with Bobby on this one......I bill in advance.
 
#12 ·
steve122 said:
In Illinois you can file a mechanics lien against the property, but you have to do it with 6 weeks of the due date for it to be valid. In Illinois the forms are available from the county clerk's office, all you do is fill them out, with the tax parcel number of the property you are filing a lien against, return them with the fee paid ($18) and the County Recorders office sends them back with book and page as proof of filing. You can add in a fee for the trouble you have gone to also. Then you can send a letter to customer, copy of lien attached, and let them know they can have it removed for the cost of mowing, fee for filing and your fee for time and trouble, and the fee to file a release. If they don't pay the lien stays until property is sold, and then you get your money. Mean time they have a blot on their credit. Last one I did was for a one time cutting, for $100. She wouldn't pay, filed lien for $250 for $100 dollar job, and she had to pay $250 plus another $18 for filing release.
Do a google search for Mechanics Lien for your state, you should be able to find the statute, read thru it, (all legalese), or see an attorney for a explanation of ins and outs for your state, and then do the rest on your own, each and every time it happens. Good luck, and this is not legal advice and I'm not an attorney who cuts grass.
What if they are just renting? Which is 90% of the people here in this military town!
 
#13 ·
Soupy said:
A lot of us invoice monthly after the work is completed. Then we give them a month to pay. This puts a non payer at 2 months.

I invoice on the 1st of each month for the previous month and give a 15net pay but even a good percentage of customers still pay around the 20th or so(I believe that is because they get paid around the 15th). So I go ahead and let people have the full 30 days to pay. I always get burned by a couple each year, but if I was strict and held to the payment by the 15th I would piss off a lot of otherwise good customers. Even if they don't pay by the 15th and we cut them off they still owe for 1 1/2 months.

It's part of being in business and like any business you have losses. I can see were a guy cutting grass would want to be paid after each cut, but most lawn care companies invoice their customers.
I do the same kind of billing. I bill most my customers in the beginning of the month and invoices are due 15 days after the billing date date. Most of my customers are on time or earlier, but a few are late. On every bill there's a notice that says "There will be a $25 charge on all returned checks. 10% interest will be assessed on any bill 30 days past due." This lets the customer know that these due dates are firm and that penalties will be applied. Although some customers still seem not to care :cry: .
 
#14 ·
I try to sell a season agreement to all customers. One of the stipulations with the season agreement is they are bill a month ahead of services. Of they fall 30 days behind services cease until account brought current. I also add a $10 or 10% late fee on the 31 day, and $1.50 processing fee.
If I have to bill a customer after services rendered, on the 21 day after bill is sent a reminder is sent that late fees will be applied on the 31 day if bill is not paid.
just my 2 cents...
 
#15 ·
I bill every 2 weeks of service. If I have not received payment by the next 2 service performances, I call them and let them know if payment is not received by the date of the next performance, service will be terminated and the collection agency will be called. Payment is always sent out the next day in 99% of these instances.
 
#16 ·
CURB APPEAL NC said:
What if they are just renting? Which is 90% of the people here in this military town!
I always ask before hand at every estimate I give if the people are the owners of the property or renters. I never do service for renters, I only do service for the owners of the property. So in that case I get in touch with the landlord and have actually gotten some of there other properties. Lawn service just gets tacked onto the monthly rental amount and I get a check from the landlord.
 
#17 ·
Middle of the month invoicing is what we do. And, it works GREAT!!!!

Invoice goes out after the first week of service.

Payment is due by the 20th of the month.

If there is nothing received by the 30th then service stops.

This way you are never out more than one month.
 
#18 ·
bobbygedd said:
you guys will never learn. billing after the fact, and allowing 30 days to pay, while at the same time receiving more of your service, and running up additional bills, is not "part of business", it's plain rediculous. now you are issuing lines of credit to these people. what do you know about issuing credit? have you been trained in all the ins and outs of the credit laws in your state? have you been trained in how to deal with non payers, how to speak to them, how to handle them, etc? did you run a credit check before allowing a line of credit? the answer to these questions are NO, NO, AND NO. if you know nothing about electricity, you don't mess with electrical wires, do you? well, you are not a credit company, so don't issue credit. when i started, i issued credit, it didn't take me long to realize that if you don't like to get burned, you don't put your hand in the fire
Yes it is part of business! It's just that we do business differently. My prices reflect cost/overhead such as non-payers. The phone company etc are not banks either but they give credit. I bet their prices reflect bad debt.

This is why I choose not to chase every last dime down. The little money loss each year is not worth my time. Just don't let my customers know this :).

At some point Bobby you should come to reality and start running your job like a business. You will sleep much better at night and stop worrying about the little things.
 
#19 ·
CURB APPEAL NC said:
What if they are just renting? Which is 90% of the people here in this military town!
I ALWAYS ask if they are military and renters. If they are military ask for their unit. If they do not pay they can be tracked down through their unit and their BOSS will have them pay.........oh yea get their supervisors name too.
 
#20 ·
Let's see service 4 $. Brain dead people! JOHN 3:16 IZ THE TICKET
 
#21 ·
grasscatcher10 said:
what can you do when a customer owes you money for 2 months of
lawncare? I approached him about it after i finally caught up with him,
and he ordered me off his property. any suggestions would help.
Well I do not know about the laws at your location thou I might assume things are similar...? Here in Virginia, when someone does not pay, we HAVE to give them 90 days so long they INTEND to pay. There's a bunch of legalese to define what is and what is not intent, but to cut the bs in your case the customer has clearly indicated he does NOT intend to pay (he told you to get outta here, and that sounds pretty clear to me).

Now I am no attorney and I can not tell you what to do, but when someone does that to me, I have a little something foder azz.
You see, it is simply not worth it to take them to court, because:
1) It costs ANOTHER 40-some dollars for the filing fee, you have to pay this first.
2) YOU have to show up at the courthouse at LEAST 3 times. This will cost you at LEAST several hours in court-room time alone.
3) YOU are not compensated for any of this, and the money you MIGHT recover only covers cost for something already gone by - You should get paid NOW, and going to court is like working for free - Plainly put, you can earn as much if not more money by simply drumming up more work and NOT going to court.
4) IF the judge eventually rules in your favor (yeah, it could happen they actually rule for the defendant), they now owe you the money AND are instructed to pay this by the court, but guess what? They STILL do NOT have to PAY!
Ex: No, if the judge rules in your favor, NOTHING happens to them if they do NOT pay. Ok, you can now take out a lien on their house (another 40-some dollar filing fee), yes, yes, add all this up plus a little interest, you are now out your original money +80 dollars +a LOT of time, and hopefully you get 10 bucks in interest for your *&%^

Yes, isn't the world of scamming lovely?
Perhaps now we begin to understand each other on these boards, perhaps now some people understand why it drove me over the edge... After all, what do you do?
Yeah, come on, give me all the good answers: What do YOU do????
Now I will tell you next post what *I* do.
Peace
 
#22 ·
jt5019 said:
You can said him a Legal notice that you are going to collections and try to scare him.Thats usually all it takes for me.Or you can go the other route put some round up in a squirt gun and write a nice letter on his lawn. Or just put DEAD BEAT NON PAYER so everyone can see ;)
Yeah now that is vandalism - a misdemeanor punishable by up to 12 months in jail and/or 1000 dollar fine.
 
#23 ·
Charles said:
This is an interesting law:

Theft of services
Theft of services is the legal term for a crime which is committed when a person obtains services - as opposed to goods - without lawfully compensating the provider of said services.

Crimes of this sort are typically prosecuted as Quick Facts about: larceny
The act of taking something from someone unlawfullylarceny, and may be either a Quick Facts about: misdemeanor
A crime less serious than a felonymisdemeanor or a Quick Facts about: felony
A serious crime (such as murder or arson)felony, based upon the value of the services illegally obtained. Specific examples of statutes covering these matters include Section 165.15 of the New York State Penal Law and Section 502 of the California Penal Code (in the latter state the main section dealing with Quick Facts about: theft
The act of taking something from someone unlawfullytheft, Section 484, may also be applicable depending on the precise circumstances of the case).

This category encompasses a wide variety of criminal activity - including, but not limited to, tampering with an electric or gas meter so that the true level of consumption is understated; leaving a restaurant or similar establishment without paying for the meal; and "turnstile jumping" or other methods of evading the payment of a fare when using a public transit vehicle.

These statutes have also, on occasion, been applied in the realm of Quick Facts about: health care
Social insurance for the ill and injuredhealth care, when hospitals or other health-care providers have pressed criminal charges against indigent, uninsured patients who were unable to pay for their treatment. One such instance was reported in the February 19, 2004 edition of the Wall Street Journal, involving two hospitals in the Quick Facts about: Champaign-Urbana, Illinois
Hey now, I like that - Theft of Services.
You see, when criminal charges are filed, they go to jail if they don't pay - Much, much better than the other bowlshed.
Yes, I believe 200 dollars is a misdemeanor, forgot the amount for a felony AND that is in VA.
 
#24 ·
Tn Lawn Man said:
Middle of the month invoicing is what we do. And, it works GREAT!!!!

Invoice goes out after the first week of service.

Payment is due by the 20th of the month.

If there is nothing received by the 30th then service stops.

This way you are never out more than one month.
FTS - I don't work for free! Maybe you're never out more than a month, but out you are.
 
#25 ·
Ok so they give you that 'I do not intend to pay.'
Since they do NOT intend to pay, they got 5 days or else.

Like the mechanics lien, here in VA same thing but before I do that, I post a hand-delivered 8.5x11 letter inside a manila envelope on their door.

*** WARNING *** - If you are not 100% sure they owe you the money (such as, you gave the estimate but they never really said yes but you assumed they wanted it done, I mean you gotta be sure)... This can be considered racketeering and land you a phat prison term.
That having been said...

This letter states:

(put in names and whatever)
(describe work performed AND price discussed - they did say YES, right?)

You are hereby informed of the following:
Work was performed upon your verbal agreement to pay x-dollars in exchange for said work. The work was completed on (date) and payment is expected upon completion. You have 5 days in which to pay or a lien will be enacted upon your house. Send your money to (address) within 5 days, or a lien will be taken out against your house.

and tyvm

- I've only done this once, had a friend who did it a few times - It's very unusual but some like to push-come-to-shove you around - With that little method, I ALWAYS get paid.
Bonus: Next year, you can expect a LOT less bs (word of mouth gets around)

Oh, two more things:
1) You will get your money.
2) If you don't, go to the CH and take out a lien (but yeah, it's gotta be like that in your state)
 
#26 ·
bobbygedd said:
you guys will never learn. billing after the fact, and allowing 30 days to pay, while at the same time receiving more of your service, and running up additional bills, is not "part of business", it's plain ridiculous. now you are issuing lines of credit to these people. what do you know about issuing credit? have you been trained in all the ins and outs of the credit laws in your state? have you been trained in how to deal with non payers, how to speak to them, how to handle them, etc? did you run a credit check before allowing a line of credit? the answer to these questions are NO, NO, AND NO. if you know nothing about electricity, you don't mess with electrical wires, do you? well, you are not a credit company, so don't issue credit. when i started, i issued credit, it didn't take me long to realize that if you don't like to get burned, you don't put your hand in the fire
Bobby. I agree with you, however, in this area at least, you'd be out of business in 6 months using the correct methods, ie prepay. There are just so many "big boy" LCO's around here that the customers would just move on to the next monthly billing lawn company. But, most people around here are honest enough that they do pay, even when there is a dispute, on time. It is just the norm for this area. I've only had a problem collecting once, that I can recall. And she was a weekly payer. Would just disappear as I was mowing. I had to wait 6 weeks to get payed $25.00 + tax. Had to threaten take her to small claims and harass her for that. I'll admit I almost got out the shovel on that one though. :waving: Come to think of it, she was from the Northeast.
My most reliable payers are monthly billed. Of course I'm more particular about whom I take as a client too.
The only time I get a prepay or deposit is on work over $500.00.
Maybe it is just the difference in culture. Farmers vs "big city slickers". payup
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top