Echo Stick Edger Problem

Discussion in 'Mechanic and Repair' started by Toolman 1, Mar 3, 2003.

  1. Hud

    Hud LawnSite Member
    Messages: 63

    Well, I like this. It's kindof like a pop quiz isn't it? Here's my first thought (actually, my first thought in response to your question, I don't remember my first thought), keeping in mind, where I am, we're sucking up Jack Daniels and doing the Kareoke (spelling?) to Van Morrison's "Oh, The Water" or maybe you know it as "It Stung Me."

    Anyway, if the choke is wanting to be on in order to keep running, it's wanting less air and more gas. This happens a lot with motorcycles that've sat around a long time, the gas has gone bad, and they don't want to run 'cause the bad gas can't get through the stopped/gummed up orifices.

    Dump the gas from the tank. Make sure the hose from the fuel filter to the carb is clear. Make sure the fuel filter is clear. Make sure the hose from the primer bulb back to the tank is clear. Remove the back of the carb: the side opposite of the primer bulb; keep track of the little screws and how the diaphragm goes on, remove the tiny screw that holds a tiny needle & seat & itty bitty spring (Be real careful on this one). Remove the 2 screws holding the primer bulb on, and remove primer bulb. Set the unit in an oil drain pan, put on some goggles and rubber gloves, and spray all the little holes you've uncovered on each side of the carb with carb cleaner (remember, in CA, they say carb cleaner causes cancer). Careful when you do this 'cause some of those orifices (holes) will be pointing back at you. Do this enough so you think you might have cleaned them (the orifices). Then carefully put it back together. Put in fresh gas. This may not be the problem, but it's an easy way to eliminate some things.

    Take your time. Remember, this unit has been sitting in the back yard for awhile. It might take some effort to straighten out. Clean orifices, clean air filter, and clean, fresh gas, then let's try again. And the plug is good, right?

    Anyone else out there wanting to jump in on this, please go ahead. Your input is appreciated. Van Morrison is on "Wild Nights Is Calling", and a cute babe (I'm married to her) is asking for a drink. Life is fun! Gotta go.

    PS Your Echo doesn't have a fuel pump, does it? Just kidding; that's a Briggs & Stratton joke.:D
  2. LawnMowerMan2003

    LawnMowerMan2003 LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 768

    OK, thanks for the input. I just have one question before I clean out my carb (I already dumped the old gas out of the tank before I started it). When my blower started doing this before, I know that the shop cleaned out the carb, cause I sat there and watched the guy do it. Now, I realize it has been sitting around in my back yard a while, but it still did the same thing right after the carb was cleaned out. I also saw him replace the fuel filter. I think this is how the shop came to the conclusion that the cranks seals were leaking air, after they got tired of messing with the carb. They even changed the settings on the carb a few times and this only resulted in a temporairy solution. Do you still think I should clean out the carb? It only takes the mechanic 5 minutes, but I'm sure it would take me considerably longer. Does this still sound like it could be the crank seals?
  3. Hud

    Hud LawnSite Member
    Messages: 63

    Spraying out the carb to verify it isn't clogged with old/ gummed up gas is just a way of insuring it isn't. It's not a difficult thing to do, but if you think the mechanic did it when replacing the fuel filter, and you're not comfortable doing it, then let's assume it's OK. But I've got to warn you, if that's beyond your ability, what follows is not more difficult, but it is more involved. Remember, you said this blower has been in the back yard for a year, so do what you can, and learn from it.

    You seem to have bad crank seals on your mind. Here's what it sounds like if you have a bad seal sucking air into the crankcase when you open the throttle. It goes: bwaaaaaaaah when you give it gas. With the engine not catching, and no power.

    It's not difficult to find out. You didn't specify which blower you have so I'm assuming mine (PB2400) is similar. Start with the seal under the pull rope. Remove the plastic engine shroud that covers the muffler and cylinder, remove the pull rope assembly (4 bolts?), and when you remove the pull rope assembly you'll get a hint if this seal is shot. If this seal is bad, you'll probably see it's all oily in there. Remove the spark plug, lock the piston preferably with a piston lock/block tool, put the proper size wrench or socket on the nut/assembly that the pull rope mechanism engages, then give the wrench a light sharp tap counterclockwise. It should come loose easily. Look where the crank comes out of the engine block. That's the crank seal. Poke it with a small screw driver. Is it broken? If you can't tell, replace it anyway. Gently pry it out, and tap in a new replacement using a socket that rests on the outer edge of the new seal. Grease/oil up the new one so it fits in easily.

    If you want to check the seal on the fan side, remove the plastic cover over the fan. Remember, any bolts that seem overly tight, spray with penetrating oil, and let soak. Next, use your tool to lock the piston. Remove the nut holding the fan on (counterclockwise?). You have to remove the inner cover now if I remember correctly; if you made it this far, you'll know. Again, if the bolts are tight, spray and soak with penetrating oil. The nut you took off previously to remove the fan was threaded onto a threaded rod attached to the nut that holds the rotor(?) on. Remove it. Then screw it back on about a half inch. Put a small piece of wood over the end of the threaded rod, lean the blower over so the rotor is pointing down. then gently tap the piece of wood. The rotor will pop loose. Remove the rotor. Look at the crank where it comes out of the block. That is the crank seal. Pull it/replace it like you did the other one. Put all the stuff back on.

    There ya go. Remember, there'll be a test on pages 1 thru 4. Open book. Take your time.

    PS Aaaaah, San Antonio. It's called the Riverwalk or Riverwatch, isn't it? Been there; nice place.

    PSS I'm sorry to laugh. But in reading your last post and having moved from JD to Miller Genuine Draft (I'm trying to lose weight; it's my belly you know), I come up with this soap opera dialog:

    Nurse: Doctor, I blew out his tubes, and changed his fuel filter. I'm afraid it didn't help.


    Nurse: I'm sorry to tell you Chuck, errrr, I mean Doctor, his seals are blown. We have to operate on his seals.

    Doctor Chuck: OH MY GOD! (to be continued)
  4. LawnMowerMan2003

    LawnMowerMan2003 LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 768

    It's not that I don't feel I can clean out the carb. It's just that the blower seems to be doing the exact same thing it was doing right after the carb was cleaned and adjusted, but I see what you are saying: Eliminate the easiest things first. I once watched a mechanic taking my mower apart and I heard his boss ask him "Did you check the spark plug?" The answer was "No." His boss said "You might want to check the spark plug before you overhaul the engine." And, I have to admit I would feel dumb if I took the engine apart to replace the seals and it turned out to be the carb. I'm just thinking that the shop elimated that possibillity for me already, cause they knew I didn't want to pay them to replace the seals, or they just didn't feel like doing it. I never asked them exactly how much they would charge to do it, but they said it wasn't worth it, and I only paid $60 for the blower, since I bought it used. But as you said, I'd really like to learn how to do theses things myself, because the shop sometimes takes weeks to repair them, not to mention the fact that if you pay 3 $50 repair bills for your $150 blower, you could have bought a new one. So I think it will be a good experience for me, unless I take it apart and break it all the way.

    Wish I had some JD, but can't afford it with 5 customers!
    Anyway, I'll let you know what happens.

    Doctor: Nurse, hand me the sledge hammer!
  5. Hud

    Hud LawnSite Member
    Messages: 63

    Dayum, I'm really glad to see you've got a sense of humor. I'm laughing my buttocks off at your last post. Very funny! It's true. If you have a good piece of equipment, check the simple stuff first.

    Having said this, you're looking at this like blowing out the carb is any more difficult than replacing the seals. It's not. You or your dealer is giving you a major case of intimidation, but that's how most repair places make and charge big bucks. "Uh, Mr. LMM03, in order to repair your Echo Doodad Wombat, we'll have to discomboobulate your widget, frattle your impood, and empty your wallet." And I'm not knocking them for it. Hey, repair folks have to make money to stay in business.

    You know, this isn't rocket science. If you looked at that blower you're trying to repair like..."man, I've got to fix this blower, cause I need this blower, and I don't have the bucks to buy a new one (said in the voice of Jack "you can't handle the truth" Nicholson)." You'd fix the blower. You've heard this before I'm sure, but I'll say it again,"this isn't rocket science. This isn't even roc...."

    Take it apart carefully, and put it back together carefully while thinking about what you're doing. If there's anything I've observed from this internet interaction, if you tell the world you've tried your best to fix it, you've done this, this, and this, but you're up against a rock, somebody will help you. This blower has been living in the back yard. Try to fix it as best you can.

    Nurse: I can't hand you the sledge hammer, as you well know, you French bas tard, because I'm pregnant with your baby.

    Orchestra: Dunt, duh, dunt, boom.

    Doctor: You insult me, BeeOtch. I am not French. I am Quebecian Canadian, and doooon't you forget it. And oooooooze buh-bee is this, if it's not mine?

    Camera: Closeup on nurse's face. She scowls pensively (look it up). Camera fades to black......Stay tuned.
  6. Jason Pallas

    Jason Pallas LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,335

    adjust the high and low speed idle screws
  7. LawnMowerMan2003

    LawnMowerMan2003 LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 768

    Well, I still haven't taken the blower apart. I've been busy the last couple of days with marketing. By the way, Jason, while it certainly wouldn't hurt to try adjusting the carb, the mechanic at the shop tried this several times and this didn't help in the long run. I'm going to try using it next tommorrow, or next time I mow, and see if it will run good enough to blow off driveways. If it will, maybe I can wait to tear into it.

Share This Page