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Employee could have died today...

3K views 10 replies 8 participants last post by  nobagger 
#1 ·
I have a guy thats been with me for 2.5 years now have a seizure right next to a 200ft cliff. We were picking up large tree branches as part of the spring clean up. He was talking about his son and school one minute and not 2 seconds later I turned to throw a branch on a the tarp we were dragging around and saw him on his back. I thought he pulled a stick out and just fell backwards, then I noticed his hands all cramped up and thought oh sh!T. I used to work as an EMT with our city's Ambulance service so I knew what to do but man was he lucky, another 10ft the other way and he would have fallen about 200-250 feet down a cliff. In the time he's been with me, I never witnessed or even knew about his condition. Now what? I certainly can't let him drive any equipment in fear of all the liability or the catastrophe that could happen, I'm screwed! I can't fired him (not like I want to) I cant let him run equipment, he could only run a string trimmer and 21" because of his previous broken arm now I worry about this if he was just walking and seized then fell and cracked his head open. The American Disability Act really has you bent over IMO. You as an Employer can not ask about any existing health conditions nor does the potential employee have to disclose any of this info. Once again, its really becoming more appealing to be an employee.
 
#2 ·
While the ADA does protect him, there are cases where you can let him go if a medical condition prohibits him from safely doing any job. How large of a company are you, can you make a spot for him as a dedicated laborer or trimmer guy? Of does that spot also require driving equipment or vehicles? The big thing with the ADA is that you have to show that you do not have a position you can put him in that will not negatively effect your business. If you put him on a trimmer, are you going to need to hire another employee to do his old tasks?

I would talk to him about your concearns and stress that it is his safety you are concearned about. If he has been with you for 2.5 years then I would assume he's a good employee. I would maybe offer him a layoff so he can collect until he finds somewhere he can safely work. Yes your rates will go up, but it will probably be less than the cost to bring in a part time guy to make up for his slack.
 
#3 ·
While the ADA does protect him, there are cases where you can let him go if a medical condition prohibits him from safely doing any job. How large of a company are you, can you make a spot for him as a dedicated laborer or trimmer guy? Of does that spot also require driving equipment or vehicles? The big thing with the ADA is that you have to show that you do not have a position you can put him in that will not negatively effect your business. If you put him on a trimmer, are you going to need to hire another employee to do his old tasks?

I would talk to him about your concearns and stress that it is his safety you are concearned about. If he has been with you for 2.5 years then I would assume he's a good employee. I would maybe offer him a layoff so he can collect until he finds somewhere he can safely work. Yes your rates will go up, but it will probably be less than the cost to bring in a part time guy to make up for his slack.
This is a tough position thats for sure. His primary job/jobs are to string trim and occasionally uses a 21" mower. But, this year I put him in charge of the sidewalk crew (himself and 1 or 2 other guys) and was going to let him start running the bigger mowers and hire a newer guy to start him off on a trimmer, 21" so I can take a break from mowing and focus on more customer relations and doing more estimates. But now what?
 
#4 ·
you could have him sign some form of a waiver stating that you aren't responsible if he gets hurt due to his condition since that is beyond your control...just talk to him about it and see what he thinks. obviously he knows there are dangers involved.
 
#5 ·
Has your employee recently changed his medication? Is he stressed about some-thing?

Some laws suck! Medical conditions should be disclosed in the beginning so that both parties can work out a solution.

Yes my employees have a right to privacy, but I care about them.
If they have a problem, or have developed a problem that is going to effect them and maybe my business, then I believe I have a right to know.

I am not aware of such strict guidlines where I operate. We are not so litigious here.

Can you privately ask him any-thing about his condition? Can you get him to go to the Doctor for monitoring?

I've had employees with a.d.d. and a.d.h.d. They had to be left on their same old routines and all was fine. If they deviated from routine they screwed up or got hurt.

I had a great employee for four years with a drinking and gambling problem.
He was married with a baby.
His problems got so bad that I finally had to let him go.

'You don't use my trucks and company time to sit in the mugs and jugs strip joint, skip clients and drive home drunk.' I caught him and towed the truck to the shop.

By the way, he told me during his first employment interview what his mental hangup was. He had watched his Dad murder his mother when he was a kid and he grew up in foster care. Any-ways...

I don't know what set him off drinking so heavily in the end. He quit when I caught him.
I offered him help getting counselling, so he could keep his job. But he was too stubborn to accept any help.

Too bad. Really hard worker and the clients liked him too.

The point is, I knew of his problems and was willing to help him deal with them because he was a valuable employee. My 2 cents worth.
 
#6 · (Edited)
You need to find out what is causing it, people don't just up and have seizures for no reason,
at least not usually and if it's the first there may be more to follow, and I am sorry to bring this
one up but also alcoholism in its late stages can do it, too.

This is one line of work where unfortunately drug addiction and alcoholism are all too common, if you are
unfamiliar with this peculiarity of landscaping this might be as good a time as any to find out about it, not
saying it never happens in any other line of work but the lack of urinalysis and the general complacency plus
the working outdoors and relatively unsupervised, all of these factors and more can easily all play a part in it.

This, however, merely underlines the seriousness of the situation and is by no means indicative of such a problem,
seizures can and are caused by any number of reasons, but they can not be taken lightly, they need to be taken seriously.

And it's not that I'm not up to giving someone a chance, even if the seizures could continue,
but you need to know what it is you are dealing with, what it is you are up against, what it is
you need to look for, and what it is this employee might need in terms of special care.

I wouldn't play with no waivers, that is, at least not until you know why,
and it's the employees responsibility so have them go to a doctor.
 
#7 ·
You need to find out what is causing it, people don't just up and have seizures for no reason,
at least not usually and if it's the first there may be more to follow, and I am sorry to bring this
one up but also alcoholism in its late stages can do it, too.

This is one line of work where unfortunately drug addiction and alcoholism are all too common, if you are
unfamiliar with this peculiarity of landscaping this might be as good a time as any to find out about it, not
saying it never happens in any other line of work but the lack of urinalysis and the general complacency plus
the working outdoors and relatively unsupervised, all of these factors and more can easily all play a part in it.

This, however, merely underlines the seriousness of the situation and is by no means indicative of such a problem,
seizures can and are caused by any number of reasons, but they can not be taken lightly, they need to be taken seriously.

And it's not that I'm not up to giving someone a chance, even if the seizures could continue,
but you need to know what it is you are dealing with, what it is you are up against, what it is
you need to look for, and what it is this employee might need in terms of special care.

I wouldn't play with no waivers, that is, at least not until you know why,
and it's the employees responsibility so have them go to a doctor.
Well I guess he went down to the ER but an ER can only do so much. But I guess he can work but no driving until he see's a neurologist. He says his ex-girlfriend/ex-fiance can drive him at least to my house but I don't see that lasting too long. I don't know, why cant life be simple,lol
 
#9 ·
you could have him sign some form of a waiver stating that you aren't responsible if he gets hurt due to his condition since that is beyond your control...just talk to him about it and see what he thinks. obviously he knows there are dangers involved.
that'd likely be tossed out by a judge as an "unconscionable clause", as it's assumed most employees would sign it to avoid getting fired for some other pretext.
 
#11 ·
my mom has epilepsy..they have no idea why she has seizures...averages about 1 per year...no lonnger has her drivers license
Yeah I don't know if they know anything about seizure's. Well he comes back to work tomorrow so we'll see. I hired a guy who a friend of mine referred to me that day (dumb luck he called me a few hours after this happen). This guy comes with 8yrs experience, a landscaping degree and just seems like a good guy so again we'll see. The bad thing is its always going to be in the back of my mind now.
 
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