Let's see how this one goes. I've been a part of these things in the past and they can be pretty powerful when you have alot of discussion going on. Believe it or not alot of industry peers go through the very same things and it's comforting to know you are not alone. If time permits, and the weather cooperates I might be able to take them to a project that we have locally. Mother nature has not been all cooperative, so one thing at a time.