Granular PreEm app then mowing

Discussion in 'Fertilizer Application' started by khutch, Aug 29, 2012.

  1. Smallaxe

    Smallaxe LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,082

    I was asking Humble1 about pre-m so early in the season(cool-season grasses)...

    it makes everything from dormant seeding to springtime root growth all but impossible and it is wasted away a full month before the CG comes in...

    its a thing with me... :)

    I specialize in growing grass while squirt&fert guys, try to beat the clock on Forsythia Bloom... at least if they started at Forsythia Bloom the dormant seeding would be up and for the most part the roots would have gone through their growth spurt as well... but before the first mowing???
  2. coolbrze

    coolbrze LawnSite Member
    from VA
    Messages: 132

    Would think that it's best applied after mowing, if you mow after granule application, you may not get consistent results as you may blow much of the pre-m around. Also, if you bag, you're going to pick a lot of it up.
  3. humble1

    humble1 LawnSite Silver Member
    from MA
    Messages: 2,519

    Up here landscapers mostly start cleanups in April, so we have to wait till they are done, we can get crab germination early may if the weather is hot,or you get a few weeks of rain... so in order to get all our apps done in time we have to have our first round down as pre emergent w fert. Prob wouldn't be a problem if I only had a hundred accounts, but once you get over 500 accounts you need to be slinging it down early
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  4. RigglePLC

    RigglePLC LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 13,449

    Our first mowing here is about the last week of April or first week of May. A good time to do crabgrass control. Axe, I am sure you would not approve. When I was in the business we had to start a bit early to be sure we had time to complete all our customer accounts before the soil temps hit 55. Typically about second week of May.
  5. Smallaxe

    Smallaxe LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,082

    That is the primary reason for early application of Pre-M,,, the busy professional with lots of ground to cover before it gets too late... you guys don't have much choice in the matter... unfortunately this has become a "Standard" in the industry for those who don't have that problem...

    for the DIY or the Full Maintenance Operator, pre-m won't be an issue before the first, even second mowing... at least that is true around here... if the ground is too cold for the cool-season turf to come alive and start growing, it is certainly too cold for CG to come up in that turf...

    and remember, if the turf is any good at all, the CG often has to wait until it gets really hot before it sprouts in amongst it... if the turf isn't any good then it is best to seed and make it good, first... :)
  6. unit28

    unit28 LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,554

    We had hit above 60* a few days in January 2012
    go find the record highs for March, amazing what the temperature map looked like with all the broken records for highs.

    for catching the right application timing this year, you should have been throwing down in
    August 2011. yuuup

    "On April 9, 2012, NOAA officially classified March 2012 as the warmest March ever recorded in the United States since record keeping began in 1895. Over 15,000 U.S. warm temperature records were broken during this time (7,755 daytime records, 7,517 nighttime records). Many areas saw temperatures some 20 to 40 degrees above average."
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2012
  7. humble1

    humble1 LawnSite Silver Member
    from MA
    Messages: 2,519

    Well I also specialize in growing grass, but we don't go by forsythia bloom, dimension works post emergently, and I include post emergent spraying for any breakthru my lawns look awesome. Additional benefit to the early fert is waking the lawn up, my lawns are the greenest on the street.
    Now I keep records of who gets overseeded in the fall and are done early enough so there is no problem come spring.
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  8. Smallaxe

    Smallaxe LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,082

    I'm not questioning anyone's perfect lawns and the strategies used to get them and keep them that way, when involved with the large business model...

    what I will say is that we didn't get CG coming through in bare soil, full sun until around Memorial Day as normal for us, right here in CentroWisco...

    Where I have a problem with the idea, is that everyone and his brother believes that CG killer needs to be applied as soon as the snow is gone... then they wonder why there is break through 3 months later when the CG actually begins to grow, here in CentroWisco... h.o.s and DIY along with full maintenance applicators, who do not have to start in March to get all the lawns in, do it anyways, because they never looked to see when the CG actually appears in the turf...

    Does anyone know what this practice does to "Dormant Seeding"???

    That is the point... not attacking anyone... only trying to make a point that has to do with flexibility in an outmoded idea... don't anyone take it personally,,, plz... :)
  9. turfmd101

    turfmd101 LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,375

    Pre-m does not effect dormant seeds. Seeds have to germinate during the barriers existence to be killed. Disturbing the soil barrier after application will create breaks in the barrier.
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  10. Smallaxe

    Smallaxe LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 10,082

    "Dormant Seeding" is an event , not a condition of a seed... I don't believe the event is possible in FL... :)

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