[Jashley73]

I was going to post in the previous thread on "How much HP for a 60 mower" to close the loop, but I see it was finally locked. (Probably a good thing.)


I finally got to answer my own question. I guess my new answer is 37hp...

I Found a 2020 model, 61" Wright ZK on Facebook. 1,100 hours, fresh service, 37hp Vanguard EFI, with a grass flap. All for the price of...........

---- drumroll please ---

$5,950



It's going to be interesting getting used to this machine. I feel pretty awkward on it, but I hope it lives up to the hype - especially on hillside performance.

 

[Jashley73]

I bought a stander this time, specifically because of one new commercial account with a pretty serious, and bumpy hill. I gained the account last fall, and I had to be extremely careful on my Exmark Lazer-Z with AT101's - which I've been extremely impressed with on hillsides - not to slide down the hill.

Everyone, and I mean everyone, swears that Standers are superior to Z's on hillsides. And a recent poll on the Wright Owners facebook group, said that the ZK's were superior to other Wrights on hillsides. The next day, this one popped up, and I responded to the seller. The next morning (yesterday) I wired him some money for a deposit, and drove 3-1/2 hours one-way to pick it up. And here we are. (I got it cheap enough that if I'm not happy with it, I can sell it, probably for a small profit, and get another Lazer.)

I have one 2-acre commercial account where I think I'll stick with the Lazer. Plenty of space to mow full-sticks there - almost 12mph - and it's almost an hour and a half of seat time. I don't think I'll feel like standing for all of that. And the Lazer having the AT101 tires helps in a particularly wet drainage area there too.

The worst part of this, is that I really don't have room at home for (2) mowers. So either my parents get a free zero-turn for a while, or I do the garage-shuffle a couple times a week. We'll see.

 

[Jashley73]

I spent some time talking with a local guy who has 5-6 Wright ZK's, and used to run Turf Tigers.

He said that when he demo'd the V-Rise gen 1, how "dangerous" it seemed pointing downhill. And quickly returned it to the dealer.

I can see a Cheetah performing well on hills. They look like they have a low center of gravity, and a nice wide footprint. I would imagine the main thing they have working against them, is the longer wheelbase to accommodate the length of the Velocity decks. Still probably a good performer though.

 

[Jashley73]

Congrats btw not bad pricing at all compared to a new unit.

A new 61” ZK with the Vanguard 37 is $14,5ish per my dealer the other day.

Hard to find a 61” ZK for sale used at all, and if you do, they're near $10k. And Stander X's & the John Deere 661r (Stander X in Green) are $4,500-6k.

So this ZK felt like a steal.

I'm fortunate to be 3 Miles from a Scag, Ferris, Bad Boy, Stihl dealer. And 3 miles the other way, a Wright, Exmark, Hustler, Stihl, Redmax dealer. The crew at both make this an easy choice. I won't be buying anything at the Scag dealer, and everything I can at the Wright/Exmark dealer.

 

[Jashley73]

Wow. That's a LOT of options in close proximity.

15 minutes away, at two other dealers, you could add Toro, Kubota, Cub Cadet, Dixie Chopper, Bobcat, Husqvarna, Country Clipper, and probably another brand or two that I'm forgetting, in addition to what's already offered close(er) to me. The perks of living "in town."

 

[Jashley73]

So yesterday, I was at a cleanup job with the ZK on the trailer, and thought to myself, "I'mma take this opportunity to try it out a little bit."

First trial, a drainage ditch that's somewhat steep at a weekly account, I may have approached this a little too aggressively, believing the hype that "sTaNdErS dO sO mUcH bEtTeR oN hIlLs BrO!"...

For proper understanding, I approach the ditch as if I were coming from the street toward the ditch, and begin turning right (would be facing the camera) as the nose of the mower starts pointing downhill. This sort of eases the mower into the bank, and as you are turning right, the downward slope becomes a left-leaning slope.

I attack this with my Lazer X-series with AT101's with full confidence, and have seldom ever had an issue here.

This time on the ZK, the left drive tire hit the soft soil, and just sank. I was stuck immediately. I tried moving back & fourth, moving the right/uphill tire to position the mower in different directions, but nothing helped. Even hopping off the platform, and treating the mower as a walk-behind as i pushed on the stationary bar... Nothing helped. Stuck...

It's worth noting, that one big difference between this mower and my Lazer X-series, is that the Wright deck is fairly centered on the frame, and the Lazer's deck is biased A LOT toward the left of the machine. This means the Lazer's left side of the deck overhangs the left drive tire quite a bit, and lets you really stick the trim side of the deck out on a limb so to speak, and lets you keep the drive tire further away from obstacles, or in this case, mud...










Oh, and then the superior ground clearance, useful for climbing curbs...
Again, stuck...

 

[Jashley73]

And the very reason for buying this mower...

THIS hill...

First cut of the season today, and I took on the very reason for buying this mower.

Again, believing the hype about how standers are superior to ZTR's on hillsides.

This first picture shows the relative angle of this hill. About 21*.

Now, my Lazer X-series with the AT101's will drive on this hillside, side-to-side all day long, as if it were on rails. In fact, I have another account with a hill that progresses up to about 26* before I turn uphill to escape.

But, it's trimming these areas that becomes a challenge.

When trimming these mulched beds on the hillside, the danger comes when you start pointing downhill.

This is where the ZTR loses it. Once pointed downhill, I either have to drag the uphill/inside tire, and basically slide to make the turn, or just point downhill and hang on...

I will say, the ZK handled this slightly better than I remember the Lazer X doing.
I was able to point downhill with a lot of control. I could almost do a complete 360 on the 21* slope with pretty good authority.

I'm still going to invest in better tires for the ZK. Either AT101's or VersaTurf's. You can see in these photos how the tires are almost completely full of the clay soil. AT101's might not make a huge difference here, but are truly invaluable when you get into soppy wet mud, and the self-cleaning nature of the directional tires starts working in your favor.

There's other plusses & minuses to the stander as well. I'm going to give it some time, and I'll express those thoughts later.

 

[Jashley73]

Like I mentioned before in another thread, my ztr was better on hills and slopes than the same brand Standers (and I love and prefer the standers). Some have said standers are better at holding hills. I’d disagree from my own experience (whatever that’s good for).

Which mowers specifically?

 

[Jashley73]

The ZK's turdsaver's aren't new, but not trashed either. I'd say better than 50% life left.

I'm going to stick with it for a little bit. It's got some big shoes to fill though.

 

[Jashley73]

The only posts I've seen where they claim a stander is better than a ztr on slopes is that you can "abandon ship" by simple stepping off versus a ztr where you are just along for the ride.

My Exmark dealer is also the Wright dealer. Also Hustler. Been buying parts there for a couple years. They are all convinced that Stander's are superior in every way. Good people, but I've stayed suspicious. Even still.

 

[Jashley73]

Well you arent supposed to put the tires in the drink!

Are ya thinking about selling the stander now? If so I'd be interested. I need another good stander for some of my retention areas.

Not yet. I'm going to try and give it a fair shake. Probably new tires, either AT101’s or VersaTurf's.

Plus, my wife hopped on it for a test drive, and did really well actually. Far better that several attempts on my Lazer. I think it has to do with the feel & sensitivity of the controls. Anyway, if we get into accounts where we use multiple mowers, this one might be "hers."

We'll see. Im going to give it some time before I make the call.

 

[Jashley73]

There's a learning curve from your lazer. Maybe you aren't comfortable on it yet like you are the old tried and true lazer. You might find as you continue to use it that it does better than you originally thought on hills. Just have to get used to it.

For sure, not as comfortable yet. Though, I can tell by the way it handles up, down, and zero-turns on that hill yesterday, that there is a marginal difference in hillside performance. Marginal. Not revolutionary as many suggest.

 

[Jashley73]

There is the problem ^^^^
Simple cure, never point down hill.

Go back and look at those pictures. Impossible to mow around those angled mulch beds without pointing downhill at some point.

 

[Jashley73]

I will state again I’ve never ran a stander, but I’m no stranger to equipment. I don’t see how a machine that is set up just like a ZTR can hold a hill any better. Other than operator position, there’s really no difference. Center or gravity is similar, stance is similar (depending on machine size). I would say from an evaluation standpoint, the difference is mental. Guys feel more stable standing because they can lean over. I would say most get too focused on the feel of sitting on a ZTR (get scared) and don’t focus on operating it. On a stander, they lean over, lose the fear, and keep focused on operating the machine. I’m sure someone will say I can’t say anything unless I’ve run one, but I’ll just shrug and say “ok, whatever”. It has to be mental.

I will say that most standers are shorter overall than Z's. Which often translates to less mass in front of the drive tires. On the Wright mowers, where the engine & pumps travel with the deck, their weight moves lower too, as the cut height gets shorter. The operator gets to shift their weight around too - lean over the drive tires, or hang your butt and one leg back off the platform.

All that adds up to something. Marginal improvement I believe, but if we're being fair, there is a slight positive difference.

 

[Jashley73]

I swear if you two ruin another thread over yet another pissing match, again, not only will I be ignoring you both, but I'll be doing more behind the scenes to make sure this stuff doesn't keep going on.

Please, for the sake of this forum, knock off the attacks & insults.

 

[Jashley73]

The ZK is a nice machine. However, your example of getting stuck in a muddy ditch is certainly not the definition of "hill-holding." I do have to agree with J Baker a little bit here - there is less perception of imminent rollover on the stander, as the operator can both lean uphill more easily and at the same time knows he can jump off with ease. I think I also agree with your initial assessment that the stander's true hill-holding ability is only marginally better than a zero turn rider. In my opinion, a stander locates the engine where the operator would normally sit, and locates the operator where the engine would normally reside. The operator will be heavier than the engine, and combined with the short wheelbase and metal frame ahead of the rear axle, the balance might be better.

I have three zero turn mowers and a relative who has a ZK61 similar to yours. My newest addition is a Wright ZXL ride on zero turn; same engine, tires, and fuel tanks as your ZK. However, I bought it new last November and haven't mowed with it yet to pass judgement. My best hill-holding mower is a Kubota which uses very low-profile rear tires and places the fuel tank down under the seat rather than in dual tanks mounted up high. That mower has excellent side-hill ability despite standard run of the mill Carlisle turf tires.

I laughed at getting stuck in that ditch. I think it was a combination of things, but what really led to it getting stuck was three-fold I believe. First, like I admitted in that post, I probably attacked that transition a little too aggressively. Second, the deck doesn't overhang the drive tires as much as I'm used to on my Exmark, so that positions the drive tires closer to the mud. Third, the crummy tires just fill up with mud, and then you're stuck. A directional tire with self-cleaning properties would probably have dug itself out, and I'd have made it out of there.

I laughed, and still do because it took me about one minute to get the mower stuck, despite all the hype that I hear about standers. No hard feelings. I'm going to stick with it for a few months at least. I'll put some better tires on it, and give it an honest shake. If I'm still not impresssed, I can always sell it & replace it with another Lazer, or a Hustler Hyperdrive.

 

[Jashley73]

I find, like others have mentioned, that the roadside commercial accounts always have some level of trash to be picked up. I can certainly see how a Stander is "faster" at this, but like @rippinryno mentioned, it's hard on clutches if you are killing/engaging the blades at WOT, which is the quickest way...

On my ZTR, I got one of the long pistol-grip trash/debris grabbers, and it lives on the mower full time. If I'm expecting a lot of trash, I'll grab a couple trashbags too. Trash goes in the foot well until I have a convienant place to drop it. This works pretty good. Often, I don't even need to push the sticks back to "neutral" - just stop, grap the trash, drop near my feet, and take off again. I couldn't imagine how much time I'd waste without it.

On the stander, I already have the trash bucket mounted. I need to pick up another trash grabber for this one too.

 

[Jashley73]

RE: Changing clutches, it can be a pain.

Last fall, I had a bottom crankshaft seal leaking pretty bad, and had to pull the motor of course, which means pulling the clutch.

I bought a pretty nice 2-jaw puller off the Matco truck years ago, and have made mod's & attachments for it over the years, including a 15" or so long beam, for pulling of stubborn brake rotors.

Trouble is, nothing was just right to grip the PTO clutch. So, being late, and not wanting to go to the day job to modify the puller beam at such a late hour, I improvised.

To my amazement, this actually worked.

The clutch blew apart, and I thought it was ruined. You can see it laying in pieces in the bottom of the 1st picture. But - I'd rather be lucky than good - I somehow managed to reassemble it, and mowed with it the very next day. And it's still working like a champ...

 

[Jashley73]

Point of Order!

If I adjust the idle from 800rpm to 1,500 so that I can engage the blades "at idle" without the engine dying...

Does that still count?

 

[Jashley73]

Jashley have you got a chance to get some more time in the saddle of the wright yet? Just wondering if it's growing on you at all as it seems that's typically how they end up gaining their loyal crowd.

Thank you for asking!

So far, I've only used it on (2) accounts. We're getting off to a slow "early" start. I'm still a few weeks away from "full time."

So far, It hasn't lived up to the hype. Lots to miss from the Exmark Lazer X-Series. I'm trying to give it a fair shake though.