Illegal Immigrants

Discussion in 'Lawn Mowing' started by Bluesteel, Dec 18, 2002.

  1. I’m pretty new to the lawn care business, and just read a post about someone wanting to start a union in their area to keep lawn service prices from falling. I’ve been a member of 4 different unions and am totally against them as a result. Never the less, something I’ve been considering lately is the effect of illegal immigrants on our business.

    Genetic traits are next to invisible to me, but cultural differences aren’t. I’ve heard of astonishing numbers of people sneaking into to our country doing the jobs “nobody wants to do.” If they’re willing to live with 5 room-mates to one apartment and eat rice and beans every day, they’re not just lowering prices, but our standard of living as well.

    One local guy (of questionable citizenship) advertises $20 for any lawn up to an acre! And his work looks just as bad as you could imagine. I have no problem with that price. If his customers are that cheap, most of us would never work for them anyway. Those guys come and go. Besides, he’s showing a lack of business sense and will never be able to make enough money to last. But if he’s not here legally, then *$## yes I have a problem with that price.

    Everyone’s got a sob-story; poor immigrants, customers on a fixed income, etc. etc. If someone wants to give price breaks to selected customers, fine. All I’m talking about is fair competition and enforcement of the law. I’m wondering what would be an effective way to make it difficult for illegal immigrants.

    More government is a bad thing. But should all LCO’s be licensed to prove citizenship? No fee, just proof that you’re legal. That way, if you suspect a crew is not competing fairly, you could find out where they operate out of, and send and enforcement officer to check.

    Suggestions? (Please, Scabs are another topic. So I’d appreciate sticking to the problem of illegal immigrants in this post).
  2. Key word Illegal.

    Illegal also mean an Illegal business.

    Make some phone calls they will be gone just as fast as you hang up the phone.

    Union's a baaaaaaaad word, it was one of the demises of our great nation. It caused substantial inflation.

    Regulating something costs money.

    Whether it is free or whom ragulates it, you will still have the scrubs. You will only make it harder on yourself.
  3. Evan528

    Evan528 LawnSite Silver Member
    Messages: 2,144

    In my area a good 90% of landscapers you see working have hispanic labor. Many if them are illeagal. I have no problem at all with it though. They do not pull down prices at all...In fact they raise them here! The mexicans in my area will not even work for less than 10 dollars and hour to start and 15 dollar with experience. These guys produce twice the amount of work per hour then a good majority of americans I have seen working. From what ive read on this board it diffrent in other I dont think ive ever seen a mexican business owner. I respect the fact that these guys are willing o leave there entire family for years at a time in another country to come here and live wih 5 other guys were room and work 15 hours a day! I think most of the landscape companys around here would have gone out of business years ago from lack of labor if it werent for them!
  4. AztlanLC

    AztlanLC LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,051

    It can not be more difficult for them to leave their family, work their asses all day, not able to get a driver license, pay SS and other taxes that they will never see a penny out of, deal with racist people like yourself.

    I'm a mexican and I do own a business, it took me 12 hard working year to be where I'm, You think it's hard to compete with scrubs? well let me tell you for me that was the easy part, it was more difficult to deal with people that thinks just because you are a mexican you shouldn't be allow to make $60 an hour.

    Yes when I got to this country I came as a illegal, I had to take jobs that nobody wanted, I washed dishes, mop floors, you name it, I didn't came down here to collect welfare, I've had paid taxes since the day I set foot in this country, I worked 6 years as illegal paying SS, and other taxes that I'm never be able to get back, I was allow to make my income tax at the end of the year, payback it not enough were witheld but never get my money back if overpaid, not even able to claim dependents even tought I had 2 back in mexico, forget about unemployment at the end of the season.

    That's pretty much the story of every mexican or any other foreing immigrant, lots of people don't want us here but nobody wants to wash their dishes,

    Just because he has a foreing look doesn't mean he's not here legally, You all (racist) star complaining when you see a mexican running a business, wearing a tie, etc. as long as they stay back in the kitchen tha't ok for you.

    This country was formed of immigrants, just cause it happened long time ago doesn't mean it didn't
  5. Richard Martin

    Richard Martin LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 14,698

    Bluesteel wrote:

    But should all LCO’s be licensed to prove citizenship? No fee, just proof that you’re legal. That way, if you suspect a crew is not competing fairly, you could find out where they operate out of, and send and enforcement officer to check.

    It won't work and I'll tell you why. Just who is supposed to enforce these new laws? They don't enforce the laws we have now. I don't know about where you live but when we hire someone here there are some forms we must fill out. One of them requires us to verify that a employee is either a US citizen (by checking for a valid ss card) or they are in this country legally via a green card.

    The point is the same people who are supposed to be making sure employers follow the current laws would probably be the same people who would enforce any new laws aimed at illegal immigrants. These laws are enforced on a federal level and not locally. Local authorities can only inform the federal authorities when they find a problem.
  6. Mueller Landscape Inc

    Mueller Landscape Inc LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 489

    Red is red and blue is blue. Being illegal is "being illegal" period. It is against the law. It has nothing to do with RACE.

    Playing the "race card" proves that YOU are the racist in my book. I know from experience that illegal labor brings wages down. I live and work in San Diego. We have hundreds of illegals crossing the border everyday. Does that mean that I don't like Hispanics? NO, I have employed many of them through the years and all had the proper paperwork. Most of them are great workers and I have Americans who are great workers too. Most people judge by character.

    By the way, I can't fault the Hispanics for coming here illegally. Their Country has low jobs and their Government is corrupt. They are simply trying to make a better life for themselves and their families in Mexico. In their shoes, I would do the same thing. But comming here illegally is still against the law. And being upset about what that does to our local economies is justified. But calling someone a "Racist" for pointing to the problem is childish and stupid.
  7. DLS1

    DLS1 LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,618

    Hey AztlanLC, how did you get a social secuirty card to pay taxes if you are illegal? I have no problem with people coming into the country the legal way. I guarantee you if there was not enough people to wash dishes then the pay for dish washing will go up. Basic economics of supply and demand.

    Why do you call people racist because they want to keep out illegal aliens which are breaking the law for being in this country?

    So does that means anyone who breaks the law (i.e. stealing, getting a ticket for speeding,etc.) in the USA can call someone a racist who reports his crime.

    Your right people do look at Mexicans as illegal aliens alot of the times when you seen Mexicans doing lawn work,etc. Everyone knows the USA government does a poor job of enforcing the borders and there are feel good organizations in the US that actually harbor illegal aliens by housing,feeding,etc. until they can become legal citizens somehow. Bush even proposed to make most illegal aliens legal but backed off as soon as the economy turned sour. I have nothing against Mexicans or any other race but we are talking about breaking the law which is a crime and people are tired of the government not caring much.

    Just to clarify I am not a racist.
  8. awm

    awm LawnSite Gold Member
    Messages: 3,354

    i have sympathy for the illegals.
    im sure its tough. the us has probably given more in forighn aid than any country in history.but the mills are closing here and movin to mexico and other cheap labor countries.this great breadbasket wont stand unless the imigration problem is solved. i ask any mexican to be honest an say whether their allegance is to mexico or this country.if u are honest u will say mexico.
  9. Envy Lawn Service

    Envy Lawn Service LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,087

    This is hard to comment on because it goes several ways. I can blame people for wanting to come to tis country to make a better life for themselves. But there are so many that just come here to take advantage of our system alltogether. But then again our government and we as people stand around and take it. Also a very lazy generation has hit the workforce. Some of which wouldn't breath if it didn't come natural. So sometimes a company has to hire immigrants to find someone who is willing to work and sweat a little or do jobs americans don't want.

    So to me the bottom line is that some people have to stop being so dang lazy and work hard for a good wage. Also if wages were raised on some crap jobs more of us would be willing to do them.

    So yes immigrants do hurt wages period. If they are willing to work for less how can it not? So that's what I have a problem with. I could care less where someone is from!

    And explain this one to me.....

    American gets his check on Friday, it's $400 after tax. Immigrant gets his check, it's $400 minus NO tax. Later business gets slow. The american looses his job after giving 10 years of hard work. The immigrant stays on. Why? Because he works for less while bringing home just as much. It's not fair and what's with the tax break?

    By the way, I run into this immigrant later and ask him about his investments, mortgage & health insurance. He explains to me that he lives in government housing and he & his family all are covered by medicaid so he has no need for insurance but he mentions having quite a large sum of money that he'd like to talk about investing..............

  10. KDJ

    KDJ LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 325

    Just because he has a foreing look doesn't mean he's not here legally, You all (racist) star complaining when you see a mexican running a business, wearing a tie, etc. as long as they stay back in the kitchen tha't ok for you.

    This country was formed of immigrants, just cause it happened long time ago doesn't mean it didn't [/B][/QUOTE]

    Well you are correct when you say "This country was formed of immigrants" But it also looks like you are playing the race card.
    Over the years this country was built strong with a ideal, a goal, a vision of freedom. All immigrants that arrived took notice and respected the laws of the land. That just is not the case with the southern boarder. Live with the truth.

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