Discussion in 'Lawn Mowing' started by moonarrow, Jan 13, 2000.

  1. Jason

    Jason LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 256

    Wow 800 lbs of fert on a lawn. That flat blows me away. You'd think it'd burn the hell out of the lawn. I grew up farming, was around it all of my life, just got out of it 2 years ago. We'd soil test to see what we'd need for fert applications. Some fields would call for 50lbs of nitrogen per acre, others as low as 20lbs. All depended on crop rotations, and type of crop being seeded. A guy couldn't afford to just dump on the fert. Besides after a certain point it does more harm than good. <br> We ran a no-till operation, which means we did no cultivation, tried to disturb the earth as little as possible. High levels of organic material were the goal. It reduced erosion, cut fertilizer needs, and as mentioned soil compaction was not a problem. We could dig a sample of soil and find lot's of earthworms, go to a neigbor's field who practiced conventional tillage you would find no worms.<br> All of this was good but to control weeds we did a lot of spraying. And the health risk is a concern. I believe it is what killed my father. He was in excellent physical shape and died of cancer at the age of 54. We'd buy roundup by the 1000 gallon shuttle. And when you spray thousands of gallon's of herbicides a year with a cabless tractor you get plenty of exposure to spray drift. <br> Sorry about rambling on but I hope organics will have a future, and I'm very interested in learning more about them.
  2. Nilsson Associates

    Nilsson Associates LawnSite Member
    Messages: 243

    Anyone interested in organic lawn, tree & shrub care, should contact me for details on how to make excellent profits providing this service. <p>Email me .. say &quot;organics&quot; in subject line<br>Send name, postal mailing address to:<br>Phil Nilsson<br>Nilsson Associates, Consultants<br>Email to Nilsson.Assoc@Snet.Net
  3. richard

    richard Banned
    Messages: 74

    all your &quot;organic ferts&quot; are not going to be complete without HUMIC AND FULVIC ACIDS...these are DNA for soil..
  4. moonarrow

    moonarrow LawnSite Member
    Messages: 223

    Phil I agree with you on taking thre years to see the full results of organics but you do start to see a noticable change the first year . concerning the costomer that changed there is a product on the market that locks up the synthetic chemicals where they they can no longer hurt the lawn can't rember what it is but will look it up and get back to you on it. In Dallas they came out with a report that said htat 90% of the polution in the Trinity river was from fertilizers and other chemicals used on home lawns. Hey guys when your kids go out to play in the yard, howmany of you have seen them take a blade of grass and put in their mouth. the inert matter on the lable consist of many things one of which is hazaradous waste (what you want your kid to put in their mouths) not me. Another thing to think about the toxic chemicials soak through your skin in just a few minutes. try this experiment take a garlic clove and put in your sock for 20 min. and taste the results. makes you think. US Gvernment to begin crack downs on chemicals in near future so get a jump on and start learning organics now. good luck Dale<p>----------<br>Dale<br>Southern lawn and Landscape
  5. dylan

    dylan Member
    Messages: 276

    I'd still like to know more.<br>If any of you guys are doing this you might<br>have the answers to my questions.<br>How often do you apply?<br>Do you use seasonal contracts?<br>What kind of equipment do you use?<br>What is the going rate for applications?<br>Is it substantially more than using chemicals?<br>Thanks<br>Dylan<br>
  6. Lazer

    Lazer LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,446

    Let me get to the definiton thing again. <br>Organic: Having a Carbon Compound Derivative.<p>If it's not the percentage of carbon that defines an organic fertilizer, please fill me in. Don't tell me I'm wrong and not give me the right answer.<p>800 lbs. of Fertilizer? on how much area? with what carrier? what percentage of N? <p>You have to define what you're talking about for everbody to be on the same page.<p>Carl<p>Oh, yeah, and I'm still looking for that answer on organic pesticides. (I think they're called &quot;Natural Controls&quot;, fill me in)
  7. lbmd1

    lbmd1 LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 462

    Lazer, <br> Not that there is such a need to be so right, wrong or exact with others on this forum on the topic of &quot;organics&quot;, here is my find on the term taken from a leading natural lawn care company. ( The use of the terms&quot;natural& organic&quot; can be very misleading and cause confusion if not properly used. In the strictest sense, any material containing carbon COULD be considered &quot;organic&quot;. Plastic for example could well be considered &quot;organic&quot; by this definition and as such, we shouldn't refer to all fertilizers as organic, but rather organic-based. From the viewpoint of organic farmers and gardeners, organic is a term used when referring to nitrogen fertilizer sources that are derived from something that was once living, such as plants, animals and their by-products.) Just thought this would enlighten other listeners in a more positve way on the subject of organics. It will become the way of the future and those smart enough to do the research and lead the way in their area will become the future lawn care leaders and both the environment and themselves will prosper!!!
  8. Lazer

    Lazer LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,446

    lbmd1,<br>Thank-you for your input. <br>The reason why I want to be so specific is because organics is an area in which we start calling an elephant a dog. <p>If the industry is in fact going towards organic, I think it's important that what we're talking about is clearly defined.<p>Without that, your competitors can out-bid you, charge a customer for an organic program and be applying a fertililizer which nitrogen derivative is only 10% post-living organism.<p>One of the problems with orgaincs is they often leave more questions than answers I think accurate terminology can turn that around. <p>Ammonia Urea is a natural animal byproduct. <br>Could I charge extra to apply this &quot;natural&quot; fertilizer? Does that make it organic? If I use this as a fertilizer, am I being environmentally sound?
  9. Jason

    Jason LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 256

    Was doing some surfing on the web and found some good organic sites.<p><p>
  10. moonarrow

    moonarrow LawnSite Member
    Messages: 223

    a good book is &quot;organic gardening&quot; by Howard Garrett, Gulf Publishing co., DEpt. KP po. box 2680 Houston, Tx. 77252-2680, E-mail give the if's ands and buts ,,,, compares snthetics to organics, gives application rates soil preps. how to control pest the natural way, organic solutions(ferts., pesticides, homemade remedies) veryyyyy informative co authur Malcome Beck, founder of GArden-ville products 20plus yrs. of experience other good books Rodale's foun in most Books a million stores hope some of you check out the radio program in my last post. good luck because people are leaning to the NATURAL WAY healthy non-toxic safe,another thing to think about synt. fert. 30-48% inertmater=waaste of money organic 100% useable by plants and turf also if not water imediatly will not burn one more plus <p>----------<br>Dale<br>Southern lawn and Landscape

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