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Palm Tree Lighting

Discussion in 'Landscape Lighting' started by EveningIllumination, May 26, 2010.

  1. steveparrott

    steveparrott Sponsor
    Messages: 1,255

    A few more pics from Bahia Beach - by the way, designed by Juan Salazar and Edgar Torres of Caribbean Landscape Products. This was a tough shoot, 100+ degrees, fire ants, over 500 acres and 1,000+ lights - took 2 nights - 10 hours shooting - still didn't shoot it all.




  2. Lite4

    Lite4 LawnSite Gold Member
    Messages: 3,170

    Beautiful as usual Steve. Love the boardwalk through the forest. They did a nice job.
  3. The Lighting Geek

    The Lighting Geek LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 886

    nice job and pics, Steve.
  4. S&MLL

    S&MLL LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 751

    Steve question for you. Some of those palms around the pool look really close to water. Is the nec followed down in PR? If not what do they go off of?
  5. steveparrott

    steveparrott Sponsor
    Messages: 1,255

    I don't know what codes they follow, although all the work was done (and is maintained) by licensed electricians.
  6. RLI Electric

    RLI Electric LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 381

    Gotta knock my fellow electricians, most don't have any idea of the 10 foot rule. First thing I saw when I saw the palms but didn't want to say because depth perception is tough in these pix. ;)
  7. steveparrott

    steveparrott Sponsor
    Messages: 1,255

    While I know that NEC has the 10-ft. rule, keep in mind that local electrical inspectors may interpret the code as they wish. (Yes, I understand that the inspector can get in trouble from his organization, but there seems to be some leniency there). If the inspector is willing to sign off on the installation, then the installer is free to do so.

    Of course, many municipalities and states are very strict, but many are not.

    Keep in mind that, from a safety standpoint, putting low voltage (under 30V)fixtures near water features (and any other location) does not present a health and safety risk (according to the definitive study by the IEC in 2005 - the work of this organization is the basis of many UL standards). History also bears this out - no serious injuries from contact with voltages of less than 47 volts for at least the last 40 years.

    There are many advocates of increasing the voltage limit in UL 1838, and eliminating the 10-ft. rule, but these efforts have been blocked for decades by certain interests.

    To be clear, I'm not advocating that anyone violate NEC. In all our instructional materials (included product sheets mandated by UL) we cite the 10-ft. rule.

    The 10-ft. rule has been a significant obstacle for creating good lighting design - how would you otherwise light the palm trees in the pool islands for this Bahia Beach project?

    I understand that the AOLP and other organizations that set standards, can not fly in the face of NEC, but I also think that there should be some recognition that in about half of the United States inspectors don't enforce this rule - and lighting designs are better because of it.
  8. S&MLL

    S&MLL LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 751

    Steve if your not getting on a plane soon I would. Might be a hurricane headed your way down there
  9. RLI Electric

    RLI Electric LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 381

    Like it or not, if you are going to be a professional, you have to follow the Code. I understand the silliness of it but you have to follow the Code. I understand the design REALLY needs it and everyone will benefit from it but you have to follow the Code.
    I appreciate the desire to make the design right, the picture come out as beautiful as it can be and the client to be as happy as possible but you cannot bend the Code as you deem fit or unfit. If you have a licensed contractor doing this and YOU know better than they do, let them know. It is the right thing to do.
    I admit I am nauseated by the fact that the out on this seems to be ,"well, a licensed guy installed it and the inspector didn't pick it up." No excuse. SM&L saw it, I saw it and now others have seen it. I say again I can go to any major manufacturers gallery (contractors too) and see this design with a major Code flaw displayed proudly and for all to see.
    I try to explain to landscape architects, interior designers and regular architects that I will install to the best of my ability. If I see a violation, I will mention it to them out of earshot of the client so they don't embarass themselves. If they don't care or say it's stupid then I will expose them and make them look inept so the client knows who is really concerned about not only the functionality and beauty but also the safety.
    I remember talking with a painter one day and he said he will still use lead paint. My face must have been shocked because his excuse is that sometimes you really need to get it done with less coats of paint. I let anyone I know that considered using this guy of the possibility of what can go on their walls.
  10. Lite4

    Lite4 LawnSite Gold Member
    Messages: 3,170

    I thought they were really more like "guidelines" Yarggh (famous pirates quote)

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