Permagreen and MSMA

Discussion in 'Pesticide & Herbicide Application' started by ThreeWide, Jul 17, 2006.

  1. ThreeWide

    ThreeWide LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,116

    Not sure if spraying MSMA out of the Magnum is going to work. Here are a couple of pics of my property sprayed equivalent to the standard 0.8 oz/M rate. Looks like the spray pattern is just too hot in the middle which causes burn, while the edges are not affected. My pattern width/turn method was the same that I use for spreading fertilizers. I have not had any issues like this with the commonly used broadleaf herbicides.

    Good thing this was my property and not a customers.


  2. TurfProSTL

    TurfProSTL LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 693

    MSMA scares me in the heat.....
  3. Runner

    Runner LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 13,497

    WAY way too hot for that stuff! Using that stuff anytime after May is danderous. Anytime temps are above 75 degrees and/OR they are going to get above 75 degrees during the first week of being sprayed (even if irrigated), it is just too risky to use.
  4. hmartin

    hmartin LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 590


    Is there any way you can bolt a boom on that permagreen for MSMA applications. The is no beating nozzles on 20" spacing for even coverage.
    I applied a lot of MSMA in late May and June at 1 oz./M with 30gpa. I spread 1lb. N per M at the same time and everything was beautiful. There was only a slight color change that lasted a few days. As long as I didn't miss any strips it wasn't noticeable. On larger properties I cut the chemical in half and applied in opposite directions. I love MSMA, the right amount in the summer will cure 90% of my problems.
  5. greenerpastures

    greenerpastures LawnSite Member
    Messages: 160


    Its been a while since I dropped in,but if I remember you treat quite a bit of 419. Hybrids are more sensitive to burn than common. As you know, everything is different when it comes to msma and southern grasses. It works poorly under 85 and may burn over 90. How many days do you have in that range? I spray case after case of msma all summer with z-sprays @ 1.25 oz/1000 +surfactant. I apply 50 GPA with the #11006 AI nozzles. AI nozzles seem to burn less than standard fans. If PG's don't give you that option, then the extra boom might be worth a try.Burn is worse in the afternoon, and increases as water volume decreases. More water is always a good thing with msma. A friend who still hose applies everything at 3 gpM seldom ever burns. Till someone invents a better dallisgrass/bluestem control, I tell my customers to expect a temporary burn after application because I hate pulling hose and most of my properties are large, commercial, or athletic. However, at the above rates, I see little burn if there is adequate irrigation and good fertility. If infestations are moderate, I always repeat the application within 14 days @ 1 oz/1000 for satisfactory control. This seems to be the key between fair control and good control. I must admit though, today it was 106---and decided to hold off. Worst damage I have done this year was where we carelessly turned on St. Augustine in shade where the msma had picked up on tires---definitely left tracks.
  6. hmartin

    hmartin LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 590

    I think these photos show what kind of pattern a permagreen really sprays. If the coverage would have been even, the burn would have been even and far less severe.
  7. ThreeWide

    ThreeWide LawnSite Bronze Member
    Messages: 1,116

    This is a pasture full of various grasses, but mostly Fescue and common Bermuda. With all of the weeds present, anything would have been an improvement. When applied, the temps were in the 80s but went to the low 90s that afternoon.

    Regarding the burn pattern, I discovered something yesterday that might have been the cause. Apparently my nozzle had been pushed to a slightly downward angle, which caused the spray pattern to be more narrow. If it had been set correctly the burn pattern would have been less significant.

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