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Pool Of Gas In Air Intake Throat before start

Discussion in 'Mechanic and Repair' started by dicharry, Aug 30, 2009.

  1. dicharry

    dicharry LawnSite Member
    Messages: 5

    I have a Kawasaki FH 601V 19Hp v Twin that pools gas in the floor of the air intake when it is shut down after mowing. The engine floods when trying to start it unless the air filter is removed and the pooled gas is mopped out with a paper towel or clean rag before starting it. Once it's started I replace the air filter (brand new) and it runs great the rest of the mowing session. I've tried clamping off the fuel intake line both before and after the fuel pump before allowing it to run dry. That didn't make any difference. There was still gas pooling in the air intake manifold before the next start up. I thought it might be a problem fuel pump, but now I don't think that's the reason for this gas pooling since shutting off the fuel line after the fuel pump didn't make any difference.
    Any help is appreciated.
  2. Restrorob

    Restrorob LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 11,029


    How old is this unit and approximately how many hours are on it ?

    I have reason to believe the pooling fuel is not your starting problem.....
  3. topsites

    topsites LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 21,653

    I am thinking the float inside of the bowl is stuck, keeping the fuel supply open.
    You'll have to CAREFULLY remove the bowl, then check out that float thing,
    make sure it moves up and down freely and somehow, I forget how but there's
    a way to check whether it opens and shuts the fuel supply.

    Beyond that you probably want to check into changing the oil and filter.
    Almost always if fuel gets in the intake like that, the oil has become contaminated.
    If it did and you continue to run it, that will wear your engine prematurely.
    You'd have to be absolutely sure somehow the oil did not get contaminated,
    otherwise and just to be on the safe side I would change it.

    Why I hate this problem, I've done so many oil + filter changes over it... :cry:
  4. DT Lawn Care

    DT Lawn Care LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 850

    it could be the needle jet/valve or the rubber gasket thing that goes down the needle slot. The needle jet is tied into the float, so just take the bowl off, remove the float and needle, and check. If it all looks good try spraying with carb cleaner then compressed air. Might fix your problem.

    I have had this exact same problem on some of my Kohlers, but they were slow seepers and a inline fuel shut-off fixed the problem.

    Good Luck
  5. mowerknower

    mowerknower LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 766

    Im not able to post the link to the service bulletin because it is on kawis dealer secure sight. But there is a couple bulletins that could relate to your issue. The first one addresses black smoke at start up. You didnt mention yours is smoking but if it is flooded out I would expect that it is. The bulletin says you will need a new carb insulator and a new carb with differnt jets. If you remove the air filter base (2 bolts 2 nuts) and check the intake flange you should be able to tell if you have the new style. The new style has a slot between the two ports.
    The second bulliten deals with the internally and externally vented carbs. Normally this would cause a running issue but you might want to verify that you have the right air filter for your carb. Check you fuel solonoid, if it has the wire plug right on it you should have the air filter that says "for externally vented carbs only". If the fuel solonoid has wires that connect a couple inches away from it you need the air filter that says "for internally vented carbs only" Just a couple thoughts hope they help
  6. mowerknower

    mowerknower LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 766

    Maybe Retro can figure out how to post those bulletins. Eng4-09 and pp0102
  7. dicharry

    dicharry LawnSite Member
    Messages: 5

    Thanks for all the helpful responses:
    Restorob, The unit is 5 years old and has 1520 hours on it and is maintained regularly.
    I just assumed the pooling gas was a problem since I cannot start it with the new OEM air filter and prefilter in place. When I remove the filter and mop out the gas, I can start it by leaving the filter off, starting it (little or no choke time) , then replacing the filter. Once started it runs perfectly. Recently replaced plugs, oil filter and oil. Plugs and oil filter are OEM parts.
    Topsites and DT, I'll take your suggestion and check out the float. I had that identical problem on an old Kohler 14Hp. I screwed up the gasket replacing the bowl, so I'll be extra careful this time. It makes sense that the gas is coming from the open bowl because cutting off the fuel line and running it dry does not aleviate the problem. Pulling the filter reveals pooled gas in the air intake after the engine shuts down due to fuel starvation.
    Mowerknower, I had a copy of a Kawasaki service bulletin from 2004 regarding oil in the carb due to crankcase vent system problems. This unit has run great for more than 4 years and just started giving me problems at start up. The smoke at start up is grey-white, and dosen't last long. My carb does have a ridge between the ports if that is what you mean by a slot between them. I bought this new air filter at the dealer(part#
    110137024 Kawasaki genuine products). The old filter was black inside indicating to me that it was running rich besides chocking at startup. I replaced the plugs, oil filter, both OEM, and oil. Currently, it's not fouling the filter inside, but I will check out the fuel solenoid. Thansk for that info.

    Best Regards to all and Thanks,
  8. Joeypole

    Joeypole LawnSite Member
    Messages: 46

    I have a 23 hp Kawi and when I pulled the carb apart and put it back together I got a pooling problem in the intake as well. Turned out the oring on my float was trashed. Replaced that and a couple other gaskets and problem solved.

    When its running the fuel is probably flowing at a decent rate therefore not sitting in the bowl. Once you go to shut down the float doesn't shut all the way therefore allowing fuel to enter as if it were running.

    I would venture to say you have a float problem.

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