Side dump vs. End dump

Discussion in 'Heavy Equipment & Pavement' started by TerraFirma Excavating, Oct 31, 2005.

  1. TerraFirma Excavating

    TerraFirma Excavating LawnSite Member
    Messages: 163

    I am looking at purchasing either a truck mounted dump or possibly a trailer mounted dump before the next construction season. I see Smithco has both truck or trailer mounted side dump trailers. Trailking makes a nice looking 30 yard end dump trailer and Bomax makes some nice looking truck mounted end dumps

    I clear a lot of land and would like a dump that will not hang up stumps or logs while dumping. The Sidedump looks perfect for this, and an end dump with the high lift tailgate shouldn't have too much problem either. I am looking at the half round end dump beds with 1/4" AR400 steel because I may also haul rip-rap, tailing, gravel, concrete demo, etc...

    One driver I talked to stated that many of the trucks pulling Sidedump trailers were twisting their frames because of the sideways forces exerted on the truck while dumping. He also stated that this could be damped somewhat by releasing any air out of over the axle air bags to resist some of these forces on the tractor. He also stated that the Sidedumps are a little less versatile dumping material because if the side placement.

    I'd like to hear others thoughts on the side dump vs. the end dump. Thanks.
  2. twj721

    twj721 LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 619

    some places you will might tnot be able to dump in due to space need to side dump which with a end dump it wouuld be a lot smaller space needed here in North East Texas area I have not seen but one of the side dump mostly end dumps followed by belly dumps then 12 yrd bobtails with 10 yrd pup trailer
  3. Squizzy246B

    Squizzy246B LawnSite Senior Member
    Messages: 837

    Side dump would be handy for us sometimes but we use the end dump. Just recently I saw a small truck for sale which did that would be handy. Might be worth looking into?
  4. Scag48

    Scag48 LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 6,067

    The Duece dump body dumps both ways to the rear and side. Although, Terrafirma is looking for a 30 yard tractor trailer setup. It's a tough call, there's a trucking outfit here has has a Sidedump'r and it looks like a solid trailer, but I would be worried about placement of material, twisting tractor frame, etc.
  5. Gravel Rat

    Gravel Rat LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 9,544

    If your looking for a good hauler look into a tri-drive roll off truck I don't mean a truck with lift axles a truck with 3 driving axles. They are used allot here for logging now they are hitting the vocational market for dump,rolloff,flatdeck,crane trucks. With locks in 3 diffs you can go pretty much anywhere if the places you are going is fairly straight.

    With a axle rating of 89,000lbs you can put a good load on them you can use 40 yard 20' bins or what ever box you want. The truck would be good for a legal 20 ton payload most end dumps are only good for that.

    With the rolloff box you can drop the bin on the ground load it up and dump it the truck will go anywhere where a truck and trailer is stuck in wide open space and hard ground.

    You add a quad axle trailer with another 40 yard bin you can carry allot of material.

    End dump and side dump trailers are only used around here for light bulkly material like topsoil. Most demo waste and landclearing debris is moved in roll off boxes its faster easier you can get the box close to where your working.

    To pull a end dump you need a good tractor with a full wet kit so you essentially need a lowbed tractor a truck with 14,500 or 18,000lb front axle with 46,000lb rears with 400 plus hp and 18spd transmission.

    If you don't need a rolloff truck go with a tridrive dump with a 17' box with highlift gate the truck should be easily 20 ton legal probably put 25 ton in it.
  6. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,157

    There is nothing better than a side dump. We can haul demo, top soil, rip rap and still be able to dump. A common saying is there are two types of end dump trailers. Those that have tipped and those that will. Side dumps will do everything that an end dump will only faster and more safe. We have a Circle R trailer. Great investment.
  7. TerraFirma Excavating

    TerraFirma Excavating LawnSite Member
    Messages: 163


    The sidedumps really look appealing, ie. loading stumps or long pieces of brush/trees with no worry of getting hung up in the dump gate. Have you seen any evidence of twisting of the frame? I see Sidedump offers a doubles configuration, so the twisting forces must not be too great or the buggy would tip.

    I have also been looking at Sidedump's Model 1000, which mounts right on the tractors frame similar to a conventional dump truck. They state that the dump body could be mounted above an exisiting fifth wheel plate. This would allow you to remove the body and be able to pull a lowboy trailer of such.

    The Trailking enddump trailers look like they have to lift quite a bit into the air to get the long dump body at an angle to dump. Like all enddumps, you will need to be on level ground, but with the added heights, it looks like it may be a little less forgiving than conventional enddumps.
  8. ksss

    ksss LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 7,157

    The technology has advanced significantly over the last 6-8 years. Mine is a 98 and is a good trailer but the newer ones are lighter and stronger. If you get one I would find one wtih air ride over the common spring suspension. We do break a few springs. The other issue is if you plan on doing custom hauling (or even for yourself) I would invest in an onboard scale system. The problem is the tubs are huge and you can get a large amount of material in the trailer and it is easy to find yourself over weight ( I had one fine for $3700.00). I got the Vulcan scale system. I was close to taking mine up to Alaska. There was a big job up there paying big money for side dumps. I priced a new one from Hawk trailers in Fargo, ND a triple axle, air ride for 37K. I am still thinking about it. I have never seen the dump truck mounted side dumps except in pictures. On the tractor side I would try and find an off road suspension Chalmers would be the best. I have a Pete 4 bag which is not great off road. I would for sure stay away from a KW 8 bag air for off road. I would also find a truck with a locker on the drives (not just a power divider). I found a heavy haul truck which is ideal I think. 20K fronts 46K rears and an 18 speed. Spreading material is somewhat tricky. I have found that being able to gear slow enough helps. When the trailer dumps there is a lot of twisting force on the tractor (it helps to dump the air if you have a bag suspension) which is why I wanted a heavy haul truck with a reinforced frame and heavy duty suspension.
  9. Gravel Rat

    Gravel Rat LawnSite Fanatic
    Messages: 9,544

    If he is in Alaska he can find heavy spec'ed trucks anywhere just go to Prince George B.C. and buy a ex logging truck. The truck brands up there are Kenworth and Western Star and the odd Freightliner SD. The hydraulics (wet kit) on the truck will be the expensive part you will have to mount a tank pump and controls.

    I don't know what gvw restrictions you have in Alaska if your restricted to 80,000lbs all you will need is a basic tandem.

    Again if you really want to haul heavy then you need a tridrive make it into a tractor you can have a legal rear axle weight of 53,000lbs with a 14,000lb front axle with regular tires or 20,000lbs with 425/65-22.5 super singles.

    A regular tractor with the combination you want to pull will probably only be legal for 100,000lbs if you went with a tridrive truck with a heavier front axle you can gross 123,000lbs. Now if you went with a tridrive rolloff truck and a trailer (3 axle) you could gross 130,000lbs.

    But if your limited to 80,000lbs your screwed anyway you look at it your limited to a 20 ton payload which isn't much. A regular gravel truck is good for 15 ton. With our gross weight maximum of 140,000lbs on 8 axles you can have a 90,000lb payload.

    Just giving you some ideas but you guys in the states use end dumps alot more than we do here. As I meantioned previously most landclearing and demo jobs you can't get a truck tractor and trailer into the jobsites these places you guys work are football fields or ever leave a paved road ?

    Most places the truck is being dragged through mud or being pulled up the road with a excavator. The worst part is you sink too far then the fuel tanks and everything hanging under the truck is dragging though the muck.

    When landclearing most of the debris is burnt the days of big stumps are pretty much gone there is the odd stump that is the size of a P/U truck. The excavation contractors here haul away with gravel trucks some jobs it could be 1 trip to 10-20 trips. For demo jobs a rolloff truck with 40 yard bins are used its the most cost effective way of hauling away the light demo debris like wood. Rip rap and broken up concrete can be hauled in dump trucks.
  10. togoffrd

    togoffrd LawnSite Member
    Messages: 1

    A freind of mine has a Smithco SD. It's got to be the most versatile dump to have. It will cycle the dump faster than my tandems can, he can haul anything from boulders down to sand for the concrete plant. It does take up more room to stock pile material, but thats usally not a big issue.

    About the only problems have been numerous springs broken, driver spacing out and forgeting to roll tarp up, or not being angled to dump and material getting into drivers getting truck stuck, and cracking fifth wheel plates. The truck frames has not been an issue. His truck supplied like 20 loads a day to a concrete plant for three years, so it got worked.

    It still is in good shape, but the four to six foot boulders have really beat it up. I don't know if they offer 5/16" A/R 500 but that might take the abuse better.It sounds like it is suited perfectly for your needs.

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