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Square footage question!

11K views 41 replies 16 participants last post by  Utah Lawn Care 
#1 ·
Wanted to get some opnions on how ya'll rate yard sizes. Tryn to put together a pricing guideline.

a 1-8000 sf= small lawn
b 8000-16,000 sf= medium lawn
c 16,000-24,000 sf= large lawn
d 24,000 + xl lawn

Are my numbers close to what you guys would use?
 
#3 ·
Dude my opinion, you're making it a lot harder than it needs to be. Don't try to pre determine your prices. Each yard you should price accordingly. Figure out what your hourly rate needs to be and go from there. From your numbers you're saying a half acre is a "XL" lawn. But where I come from that's not very large. You're just going to get a bunch of random people's opinions when asking that broad of a question.
 
#5 ·
I go by total property size rather than lawn size. Having to deal with odd lawn shapes for measurements is a huge hassle. I start with 6k sq.ft. properties and go up from there. In general, I go up in price each 1k sq.ft. until I hit 12k and then things get wider apart.
Right.Was looking to see if I can come as close to matching sq ft to the time it takes to complete the job.
 
#6 ·
Dude my opinion, you're making it a lot harder than it needs to be. Don't try to pre determine your prices. Each yard you should price accordingly. Figure out what your hourly rate needs to be and go from there. From your numbers you're saying a half acre is a "XL" lawn. But where I come from that's not very large. You're just going to get a bunch of random people's opinions when asking that broad of a question.
From what I've noticed in my area most customers would like a ball park figure,on what its gonna run.I understand that in my personal buying as well.
If I go to have my windows tinted.I want a close to or a direct price. I dont want a suprise price after the work is done.
 
#7 ·
From what I've noticed in my area most customers would like a ball park figure,on what its gonna run.I understand that in my personal buying as well.
If I go to have my windows tinted.I want a close to or a direct price. I dont want a suprise price after the work is done.
I think I was misunderstood. I'm just saying to start keeping track of how long it takes YOU to do certain tasks. How long does it take you to edge 1000sq ft? How long to mow 5000sq ft? How long does it take you to blow off 1000sq ft of sidewalk, etc? I always recommend seeing the property first before giving them a firm price. Figure out how long you'll be there and use your hourly rate to determine the price of the job. You can't just say " if you have X sq ft I'll mow for this." There's other things to factor in if you want your business to stay afloat.
 
#8 · (Edited)
Dude my opinion, you're making it a lot harder than it needs to be. Don't try to pre determine your prices. Each yard you should price accordingly. Figure out what your hourly rate needs to be and go from there. From your numbers you're saying a half acre is a "XL" lawn. But where I come from that's not very large. You're just going to get a bunch of random people's opinions when asking that broad of a question.
I think I was misunderstood. I'm just saying to start keeping track of how long it takes YOU to do certain tasks. How long does it take you to edge 1000sq ft? How long to mow 5000sq ft? How long does it take you to blow off 1000sq ft of sidewalk, etc? I always recommend seeing the property first before giving them a firm price. Figure out how long you'll be there and use your hourly rate to determine the price of the job. You can't just say " if you have X sq ft I'll mow for this." There's other things to factor in if you want your business to stay afloat.
Listen to what APL is trying to tell you. No two properties are the same. Even if they have the exact same sqftage, they will be different. So each property is different. Now do as APL said and time yourself to find out how long jobs will take you. Then you can give a price by just looking. No fancy math involved, no measuring wheel at all. As others said, you're making it harder then it needs to be.
 
#9 ·
They are right, no two properties are the same. It just takes time, you have to get out there and do some so that you learn how long it takes you, then you base future prices off your own experience.

I know it sounds awful hairy and scary but that's how most of us do it, dive in head first, don't be scared, give some estimates and go from there, you will miss some but we all did (and to a point still do), it will be all right.

Good luck
 
#10 ·
Right.Was looking to see if I can come as close to matching sq ft to the time it takes to complete the job.
Too many variables as stated above. Lawn A is 7 acres and takes 3 of us 2.5hours to mow and trim. Lawn B is 7.25 acres and takes 3 of us 4.5 - 5.5hours to mow and trim. 1/4 of an acre more but there is a lot more trimming and we have to A)bag B)use smaller mowers because of the the obstacles.
 
#12 ·
The only thing I price by sq ft (actually cubic foot) is mulch. I only do that for large jobs (> 10 yards). Otherwise, after a while you can just look at an area and guess how much mulch it will take and how long it will take you (hilly vs. flat). Yards are pretty easy, like people have said. The only people I see that price by sq ft are the big boys (Large scale operators) that want to extract as much from the client as they can.
 
#13 ·
Smaller lots you can price based on total square foot. Most houses in an area will have a drive, fenced back yard and so forth. People might ask for a discount for having a pool or big bed but do not do it. If anything charge more because of the extra trimming and keeping the grass out of the pool.

That is the same logic for corner lots, there are more walks to edge and blow so they are more.

Having said that, that typically ends some where around the 10K to 12K size.
 
#14 ·
With everything said, then how do you setup a system for your sales people to know how to price a lawn?? I currently price yards the same way as everyone here, by viewing the property and basing it on how long it will take to do. This of course has taken alot of time to get it right. But I want to get a system in place so when I have sales people they can look at a property and know how to bid it the way I want it. So how does everyone with sales people do this??
 
#15 ·
I guess it depends how big you are (revenue size). I don't trust the sales work to anyone but myself; but I understand if you grow to be a large company you would have to delegate the sales process.

You might develop a "tiered" system. I don't care how large my company is, I would not allow anyone other than myself to give final approval to a sales offer that would be more than say, 5% of my annual revenue. In other words I would have control of any offering that could severely effect my bottom line. But you could allow your sales people to price the typical yard, commercial account. My guess to do that is that you would have to have a person that had been with you long enough to trust or someone that you recruited whom you personally knew. I would give them small accounts to price and then go in behind them and see if they are on the mark with the pricing. "Delegate" but then check behind them. Even if you develop a plan with pricing per sq ft, you have to check behind them because there is some talent associated with pricing that way too. Are they lazy? Do they understand the computations? Do they have enough common sense to know they have to subtract the size of the house & flower beds from the sq ft of the lawn. I know this sounds basic, but a typical sales person does not necessarily have common sense, especially if they are commission driven (larger sq ft + more $).
 
#16 ·
I disagree. Pricing by the lot size up to 20 -25K sq ft is the best way to do it. How far off can you really be? Just have specific addons for obvious time consumers like corner lots, fences, pools, etc.

Above 25K I would want to look at the lawn before I give a price but even then you need to have a system in place to price it. How long does it take to trim around a tree? How many trees? Price per foot for blade edging? Price per foot for trimming along fences? One side or both sides? What size mower can be used? Etc, etc.

Eyeballing can work if you never plan to get out of a very hands on role in your company. But put together a detailed pricing system and then it doesn't matter who goes to do the pricing, you'll come up with the same price either way.
 
#18 ·
What do you disagree with? I agree sq ft is a good way to bid. You just have to make sure you deduct for beds, etc. Where I live it is heavily wooded and fescue has a problem in the shade. As a result some yards that are 1/2 acre have only 100 sq ft of grass; just a strip in front of the house, the rest of the area are flower beds, etc. I can't charge them the same price as the client that has a 1/2 acre grass lot. That's all I'm saying.
 
#19 ·
What do you disagree with? I agree sq ft is a good way to bid. You just have to make sure you deduct for beds, etc. Where I live it is heavily wooded and fescue has a problem in the shade. As a result some yards that are 1/2 acre have only 100 sq ft of grass; just a strip in front of the house, the rest of the area are flower beds, etc. I can't charge them the same price as the client that has a 1/2 acre grass lot. That's all I'm saying.
Absolutely, I would charge a lot more to clean beds :laugh:
Just maybe do it less often.
 
#20 ·
What do you disagree with? I agree sq ft is a good way to bid. You just have to make sure you deduct for beds, etc. Where I live it is heavily wooded and fescue has a problem in the shade. As a result some yards that are 1/2 acre have only 100 sq ft of grass; just a strip in front of the house, the rest of the area are flower beds, etc. I can't charge them the same price as the client that has a 1/2 acre grass lot. That's all I'm saying.
I don't have a lot of woods in my area and most lots are fairly similar which is where we differ. Years ago, I actually lived over in Cumberland and so I know Midlothian fairly well and you do have a different set of circumstances than I do.

But (for my somewhat treeless suburbian area) I find it more simple to base my pricing off lot size (including beds & house) and then add on for extras.
 
#22 ·
For us a small lawn is about 10 acres and a large lawn is about 70-125 acres, but it's kinda what we specialize in.

Chris
 
#23 ·
Goodness, a small yard = 10 acres? So how do you make a living a that? Large crew, or self op? It seems you would have to charge a huge amount for that. In my case, I'm like the taxi driver, the $ are in "moving and scooting". Having several yards in close proximity and trying to do 2-3 yards an hour.
 
#25 ·
The only thing I price by sq ft (actually cubic foot) is mulch. I only do that for large jobs (> 10 yards). Otherwise, after a while you can just look at an area and guess how much mulch it will take and how long it will take you (hilly vs. flat). Yards are pretty easy, like people have said. The only people I see that price by sq ft are the big boys (Large scale operators) that want to extract as much from the client as they can.
Its that the whole reason for starting a business?
 
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